andy gray on sky : "messi wouldnt cut it against stoke"

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

More complete?

If one thing's for sure, he's added nothing to his game since leaving Manchester.

As much as Andy Gray is a legend, he knows the square root of fuck all about football outside England.

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

Many myths going around. Hopefully this helps debunk one of them.

Wow, I'm really disappointed, I usually don't mind Andy Gray and say people give him a bit too much stick, but he shouldn't comment on other leagues, ever.

Messi takes hard challenges and stuff better than Ronaldo did, who ripped the league up.

Dan wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

I'm going to say... you're being sarcastic.

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Mate, he's lost something since he left us, he hasn't got a flair about him, doesn't run past players as much as he used to, he's a goal machine now but he's not a more brilliant individual player imo.

dena wrote:

Dan wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

I'm going to say... you're being sarcastic.

With the second point yeah, Barca's passing and movement will mean Stoke would have so many players sent off due to late tackles that the game has to be abandoned and Barca given the 3-0 win..



First point is true..

To be fair, the OP has misquoted Gray badly here. He gets the general gist of what he was saying, but watching it live, Gray's views were nowehere near as extreme as how they have been presented here.

kyro7 wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Mate, he's lost something since he left us, he hasn't got a flair about him, doesn't run past players as much as he used to, he's a goal machine now but he's not a more brilliant individual player imo.

Like I said to Danny, I just don't see it. The step overs are there, the flicks are there (just look at the controversy caused by his 'back pass' vs. Atletico) the runs are there.

dena wrote:

kyro7 wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Mate, he's lost something since he left us, he hasn't got a flair about him, doesn't run past players as much as he used to, he's a goal machine now but he's not a more brilliant individual player imo.

Like I said to Danny, I just don't see it. The step overs are there, the flicks are there (just look at the controversy caused by his 'back pass' vs. Atletico) the runs are there.

At United he was a much more exciting player to watch, well that's my opinion anyway, and I don't think he'd have this goal record in our league.

kyro7 wrote:

dena wrote:

kyro7 wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Mate, he's lost something since he left us, he hasn't got a flair about him, doesn't run past players as much as he used to, he's a goal machine now but he's not a more brilliant individual player imo.

Like I said to Danny, I just don't see it. The step overs are there, the flicks are there (just look at the controversy caused by his 'back pass' vs. Atletico) the runs are there.

At United he was a much more exciting player to watch, well that's my opinion anyway, and I don't think he'd have this goal record in our league.

Can't argue with opinion, but as for the second part, he already did.

Ronaldo scored 31 league goals for United in 2008, last year he only had 26.

dena wrote:Can't argue with opinion, but as for the second part, he already did.

Ronaldo scored 31 league goals for United in 2008, last year he only had 26.

I'm talking about right now, he wouldn't be able to get 22 in 24 like La Liga and I don't think Messi could get 27 in 23, plus his 15 assists.

Well, they don't have those records in La Liga, that's over all competitions for this season. Messi and Ronaldo havent hit 20 in La Liga, I'd bet both are around 16, 17. Which tbh if you'd ask me, compared to the other top scorers of leagues in Europe, and the fact these two are the best in the world, is just about right at this point.

I hate Andy Gray.


But I have to agree with him on this occasion.

Dan wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

dena wrote:Well, they don't have those records in La Liga, that's over all competitions for this season. Messi and Ronaldo havent hit 20 in La Liga, I'd bet both are around 16, 17. Which tbh if you'd ask me, compared to the other top scorers of leagues in Europe, and the fact these two are the best in the world, is just about right at this point.

Messi has 17 goals in 14 league games, and I don't know how many assists.. Ronaldo has 17 goals in 16 league games and same with Messi not sure on the assists, they are the best two in the world but I don't think they'd have that in the Premier League.

Danny wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

More complete?

If one thing's for sure, he's added nothing to his game since leaving Manchester.

Sorry but Ronaldo is a more complete player now, he also isn't as selfish as he used to be.

Shawcross would break his leg so he would be useless.

James wrote:Shawcross would break his leg so he would be useless.

I was just thinking that.

kyro7 wrote:

dena wrote:Well, they don't have those records in La Liga, that's over all competitions for this season. Messi and Ronaldo havent hit 20 in La Liga, I'd bet both are around 16, 17. Which tbh if you'd ask me, compared to the other top scorers of leagues in Europe, and the fact these two are the best in the world, is just about right at this point.

Messi has 17 goals in 14 league games, and I don't know how many assists.. Ronaldo has 17 goals in 16 league games and same with Messi not sure on the assists, they are the best two in the world but I don't think they'd have that in the Premier League.

Once again, opinion so I won't argue, just offer mine in return. It's about the halfway point in the season, if they kept on pace both would probably reach 34-38 league goals. Compensating for injuries, maybe 32-35. Ronaldo has already reached 31 in 34 games for United, so I see no reason why if hypothetically, Madrid and Barcelona joined La Liga, they could not come close those numbers. It's not like Premier League defenses are amazing, Berbatov dropped 5 on Blackburn.

Anyway, I feel like I'm doing the La Liga - EPL debate from yesterday all over again, so I'll try to leave it at that.

dena wrote:

kyro7 wrote:

dena wrote:Well, they don't have those records in La Liga, that's over all competitions for this season. Messi and Ronaldo havent hit 20 in La Liga, I'd bet both are around 16, 17. Which tbh if you'd ask me, compared to the other top scorers of leagues in Europe, and the fact these two are the best in the world, is just about right at this point.

Messi has 17 goals in 14 league games, and I don't know how many assists.. Ronaldo has 17 goals in 16 league games and same with Messi not sure on the assists, they are the best two in the world but I don't think they'd have that in the Premier League.

Once again, opinion so I won't argue, just offer mine in return. It's about the halfway point in the season, if they kept on pace both would probably reach 34-38 league goals. Compensating for injuries, maybe 32-35. Ronaldo has already reached 31 in 34 games for United, so I see no reason why if hypothetically, Madrid and Barcelona joined La Liga, they could not come close those numbers. It's not like Premier League defenses are amazing, Berbatov dropped 5 on Blackburn.

Anyway, I feel like I'm doing the La Liga - EPL debate from yesterday all over again, so I'll try to leave it at that.

Meh, maybe you're right, I just think there's such a massive gap between the best and the rest in La Liga that it helps goalscoring.

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Lol. You know what shows that La Liga is shit compared to Prem, Forlan doing well.

Ben10 wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Lol. You know what shows that La Liga is shit compared to Prem, Forlan doing well.

World Cup 2010. And Forlán isn't exactly doing well atm. So that one failed.

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Dan wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.

Ben10 wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Lol. You know what shows that La Liga is shit compared to Prem, Forlan doing well.

Dan wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Dan wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.



I can play the game you guys play, you guys can't handle it that there's a league better than yours.

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Dan wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Dan wrote:

dena wrote:I disagree completely, just youtubed "Ronaldo skills" and saw a video made in Sept. of 2009 (barely played any league games) and you can see the step overs galore, I haven't noticed any difference at all, as for a better player? The dude has 55 goals in 59 games for Madrid, better than his GPG he had at his Ballon D'or year. But uh, I'll leave it at that, I know you Ronaldo bummers would never admit to him being a better player (or more complete player, whatever) now.

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.



I can play the game you guys play, you guys can't handle it that there's a league better than yours.

Our current Champions are 4th. Your current Champions are 1st..

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Ben10 wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Lol. You know what shows that La Liga is shit compared to Prem, Forlan doing well.

World Cup 2010. And Forlán isn't exactly doing well atm. So that one failed.

Not really. Forlan's been top scorer twice in La Liga. So that one failed.

Dan wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Dan wrote:

Pablo Sarabia wrote:

Dan wrote:

Tbh, it just shows La Liga is shit compared to the Prem..


I can see his point tbh. Messi probably would struggle against Stoke when they try to boot you out of the stadium rather than the ball, Messi's only little after all..

Lol. You know what shows that Prem is shit compared to La Liga, VDV doing well.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.

Your league is basically two teams - then the rest. So shut the fuck up.



I can play the game you guys play, you guys can't handle it that there's a league better than yours.

Our current Champions are 4th. Your current Champions are 1st..

Your current champions have been shit and have had injuries, they'll walk away with it once everyone is fit again.