Let's try and get this back to the original topic before this turns nasty again.
+22
Barton
Jack
SBSP
blackskar
Mr. Hassard
Cadbury
Hernandez_14
Carlos Jenkinson
Ben
ShakerMatty
Coatsy
RubyArmyCTFC
Theo Filippo
Fanatic
Cornholio
Dink
ResurrectionRooney
Mal
Lux
moscowmadeit3
dena
Drake
26 posters
Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
Poll
Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
- [ 23 ]
[68%]
- [ 11 ]
- [32%]
Total Votes: 34
blackskar-
- Posts : 12479
- Post n°181
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by blackskar Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:52 am
Lightfoot-
- Posts : 26
- Post n°182
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Lightfoot Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:52 am
If loads of LIVERPOOL FANS didn't ILLEGALLY enter the ground WITHOUT TICKETS nobody would have got crushed.LFCJordan wrote:Lightfoot wrote:People at Hillsborough died because Liverpool fans without tickets steamed into the ground when a gate was opened. So many of them were going in that apparently you could take your feet off the floor and you would be carried by the crowd. Should the gate have been opened? No. But if Liverpool fans had not broken the law by going in without tickets them 96 people would still be alive.
Educate yourself, and don't talk shite.
http://hfdinfo.com/digital/
Thats it.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°183
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:59 am
Lightfoot wrote:If loads of LIVERPOOL FANS didn't ILLEGALLY enter the ground WITHOUT TICKETS nobody would have got crushed.LFCJordan wrote:Lightfoot wrote:People at Hillsborough died because Liverpool fans without tickets steamed into the ground when a gate was opened. So many of them were going in that apparently you could take your feet off the floor and you would be carried by the crowd. Should the gate have been opened? No. But if Liverpool fans had not broken the law by going in without tickets them 96 people would still be alive.
Educate yourself, and don't talk shite.
http://hfdinfo.com/digital/
Thats it.
Read the Taylor Report.
Dean-
- Posts : 9761
- Post n°184
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Dean Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:08 am
Lightfoot wrote:Im pretty sure loads of Liverpool fans without tickets got in the ground and the reason people were crushed is because there were too many in the terraces. So obviously its the people who illegally entered the ground's fault.
Oh my god, is he serious?
Somebody ban this clown, now.
Cadbury-
- Posts : 23487
Age : 31
Location : Blackpool
Supports : Not Kenny.
- Post n°185
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Cadbury Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:09 am
According to ResurectionRooney, we shouldn't mourn the disater if it happened before we were born. I'll remember that next Rememberance Day.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°186
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:12 am
Lightfoot wrote:People at Hillsborough died because Liverpool fans without tickets steamed into the ground when a gate was opened. So many of them were going in that apparently you could take your feet off the floor and you would be carried by the crowd. Should the gate have been opened? No. But if Liverpool fans had not broken the law by going in without tickets them 96 people would still be alive.
Your full of absolute Pish maybe read the parts where it says there were no stewards or police which there normally would have been telling the fans to go into different section's of the Leppings lane and a big notice pointing people into the section where the crush happened, so go fuck yourself and learn what actually happened. And if the game had just been delayed and had enough police and stewards to sort things out this would have never happened.
But did you ever go to football games in the 80,s or early 90,s cause i did and this was the kind of disaster that was just waiting to happen if the people controlling these games made a mistake and on that day they made errors that cause the death of these fans.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°187
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:14 am
Lightfoot wrote:If loads of LIVERPOOL FANS didn't ILLEGALLY enter the ground WITHOUT TICKETS nobody would have got crushed.LFCJordan wrote:Lightfoot wrote:People at Hillsborough died because Liverpool fans without tickets steamed into the ground when a gate was opened. So many of them were going in that apparently you could take your feet off the floor and you would be carried by the crowd. Should the gate have been opened? No. But if Liverpool fans had not broken the law by going in without tickets them 96 people would still be alive.
Educate yourself, and don't talk shite.
http://hfdinfo.com/digital/
Thats it.
Your full of it and i would luv to meet you.
ResurrectionRooney-
- Posts : 17681
Supports : United
- Post n°188
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by ResurrectionRooney Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:17 am
Cadbury wrote:According to ResurectionRooney, we shouldn't mourn the disater if it happened before we were born. I'll remember that next Rememberance Day.
I don't remember saying that.
Cadbury-
- Posts : 23487
Age : 31
Location : Blackpool
Supports : Not Kenny.
- Post n°189
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Cadbury Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:17 am
ResurrectionRooney wrote:I have apologised I don't know what more you people want from me.
To be honest, I doubt a lot of you are really offended by that comment, some of you weren't even conceived when any of the disasters mentioned happened. You just don't like me, so you seize on one particular comment and deliberately misinterpret it to try and get me in trouble with the moderators, you're like kids in class telling tales to the teacher.
Dean-
- Posts : 9761
- Post n°190
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Dean Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:34 am
ResurrectionRooney wrote:Prove it, either of you.
I'd like to think you are able to have a mature discussion and see both sides to an argument. You seem able enough, I mean you do claim yourself to be knowledgeable, so we'll see now.
http://hfdinfo.com/digital/
Click that link, go to the contents page, then go to '' The Taylor Report ''. Read that and then come back to me and tell me who you think should be held responsible for the death of 96 people.
Thanks.
SBSP-
- Posts : 50010
- Post n°191
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by SBSP Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:52 am
Burned.Cadbury wrote:ResurrectionRooney wrote:I have apologised I don't know what more you people want from me.
To be honest, I doubt a lot of you are really offended by that comment, some of you weren't even conceived when any of the disasters mentioned happened. You just don't like me, so you seize on one particular comment and deliberately misinterpret it to try and get me in trouble with the moderators, you're like kids in class telling tales to the teacher.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°192
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:42 am
You keep blaming the police but then say standing shouldn't be brought back. If it was the polices fault then there was is no reason why standing should not come back in the German form.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°193
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:52 am
James ♠ wrote:You keep blaming the police but then say standing shouldn't be brought back. If it was the polices fault then there was is no reason why standing should not come back in the German form.
Policing has improved a lot over 22 years. Plus now days fans aren't squeezed into cattle pens, with no chance to escape is a crush did happen. Plus back then the police treated everyone like football hooligans, and did not protect fans.
ResurrectionRooney-
- Posts : 17681
Supports : United
- Post n°194
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by ResurrectionRooney Mon Mar 28, 2011 1:18 am
It is 21 years since Lord Justice Taylor's report recommended that terracing at football grounds should be outlawed. The move was a direct response to the tragedy at Hillsborough, where 96 people went to a football match and never returned home.
The passing of time should not be allowed to diminish the reasons behind the introduction of all-seater stadiums, which is why I'm instinctively and deeply opposed to the reintroduction of standing areas at grounds.
The subject is back on the agenda with a fans' group setting up a petition supporting the idea and Sports Minister Hugh Robertson not wanting to appear dismissive, saying he will view it seriously.
I'm more in line with the Premier League stance that the benefits of all-seater stadiums far outweigh the advantages of having supporters standing in big crowds.
From where I'm looking, the introduction of all-seater stadiums has worked. To change it, even now, is an unnecessary risk, a view only strengthened when I remember what happened at Hillsborough and what the families of the bereaved have had to endure in the months and years since then.
For younger readers nationally who don't know the story, I was the Liverpool manager when many of our supporters were crushed to death after an area of terracing at Hillsborough became overcrowded before our FA Cup semi-final against Nottingham Forest in 1989.
Football has become a far safer sport for supporters since both terracing and fencing around the pitch were banished. There are fewer injuries and there is less hooliganism, too. It can't be wrong.
I've heard it argued that people are denied the right to make a choice between sitting and standing but if you asked people what the safer option would be, they would say sitting.
And safety is not something you should take for granted. If we are safer now, it is because the recommendations of the Taylor Report were acted upon.
The other point I've heard mentioned is that all-seater stadiums are bad for atmosphere. Even if that were true, would it not be right to sacrifice a little bit of atmosphere for safety? I don't think the argument about atmosphere is correct anyway. You can't deny that there have been some absolutely fantastic nights at Anfield since the stadium went all-seater.
Yes, the famous Saint Etienne European Cup game in 1977 when you could squeeze 26,000 into the old Kop was played in a marvellous atmosphere. But it was also extremely good against Olympiakos in 2004 when Steven Gerrard rattled one in to take Liverpool through against the odds.
People talk with some reverence about the 2005 semi-final against Chelsea when the noise and passion were incredible and sucked Luis Garcia's shot over the line. Remember, that was in an all-seater stadium.
It isn't just Anfield. I went to a Celtic-Rangers Old Firm game in the Scottish Premier League last month that Celtic won 3-0 and you couldn't tell me the atmosphere would have been any better had people all been standing and swaying on the terraces. Not a chance – it was fantastic as it was.
Maybe some other grounds don't have that old-fashioned atmosphere any more but if the reward is that mothers and fathers can take their children there in safety, that's surely not a bad thing. I'd certainly be more inclined to take my son or daughter - or grandchildren nowadays! - to a match where you sit rather than stand.
The one drawback about modern stadiums over the last 20 years which I have to accept is the increased cost in going to games.
I acknowledge that it would be fantastic to make it more affordable for the man in the street to go to matches with his kids. I don't agree a return to standing is the right way to do that but I do think we all have to find a way to make sure not every seat is expensive.
I know fans still stand in countries like Germany. But you can't compare their situation with ours. If Germany had endured a tragedy like Hillsborough, of innocent supporters dying because they went to a football match, they would have banned standing and they would not now be talking of reversing that decision.
-----------
What a fucking dinosaur, his arguments are pathetic, he talks about atmosphere being worse, then tries to disprove it by mentioning 3 or 4 games in 20 years. HE also advocates being stupidly over emotional, because of what the he think the Germans would do. Other than the kids thing (and kids can sit in the family stand) all of his concerns are addressed by the German model. He needs to stop living in the past.
The passing of time should not be allowed to diminish the reasons behind the introduction of all-seater stadiums, which is why I'm instinctively and deeply opposed to the reintroduction of standing areas at grounds.
The subject is back on the agenda with a fans' group setting up a petition supporting the idea and Sports Minister Hugh Robertson not wanting to appear dismissive, saying he will view it seriously.
I'm more in line with the Premier League stance that the benefits of all-seater stadiums far outweigh the advantages of having supporters standing in big crowds.
From where I'm looking, the introduction of all-seater stadiums has worked. To change it, even now, is an unnecessary risk, a view only strengthened when I remember what happened at Hillsborough and what the families of the bereaved have had to endure in the months and years since then.
For younger readers nationally who don't know the story, I was the Liverpool manager when many of our supporters were crushed to death after an area of terracing at Hillsborough became overcrowded before our FA Cup semi-final against Nottingham Forest in 1989.
Football has become a far safer sport for supporters since both terracing and fencing around the pitch were banished. There are fewer injuries and there is less hooliganism, too. It can't be wrong.
I've heard it argued that people are denied the right to make a choice between sitting and standing but if you asked people what the safer option would be, they would say sitting.
And safety is not something you should take for granted. If we are safer now, it is because the recommendations of the Taylor Report were acted upon.
The other point I've heard mentioned is that all-seater stadiums are bad for atmosphere. Even if that were true, would it not be right to sacrifice a little bit of atmosphere for safety? I don't think the argument about atmosphere is correct anyway. You can't deny that there have been some absolutely fantastic nights at Anfield since the stadium went all-seater.
Yes, the famous Saint Etienne European Cup game in 1977 when you could squeeze 26,000 into the old Kop was played in a marvellous atmosphere. But it was also extremely good against Olympiakos in 2004 when Steven Gerrard rattled one in to take Liverpool through against the odds.
People talk with some reverence about the 2005 semi-final against Chelsea when the noise and passion were incredible and sucked Luis Garcia's shot over the line. Remember, that was in an all-seater stadium.
It isn't just Anfield. I went to a Celtic-Rangers Old Firm game in the Scottish Premier League last month that Celtic won 3-0 and you couldn't tell me the atmosphere would have been any better had people all been standing and swaying on the terraces. Not a chance – it was fantastic as it was.
Maybe some other grounds don't have that old-fashioned atmosphere any more but if the reward is that mothers and fathers can take their children there in safety, that's surely not a bad thing. I'd certainly be more inclined to take my son or daughter - or grandchildren nowadays! - to a match where you sit rather than stand.
The one drawback about modern stadiums over the last 20 years which I have to accept is the increased cost in going to games.
I acknowledge that it would be fantastic to make it more affordable for the man in the street to go to matches with his kids. I don't agree a return to standing is the right way to do that but I do think we all have to find a way to make sure not every seat is expensive.
I know fans still stand in countries like Germany. But you can't compare their situation with ours. If Germany had endured a tragedy like Hillsborough, of innocent supporters dying because they went to a football match, they would have banned standing and they would not now be talking of reversing that decision.
-----------
What a fucking dinosaur, his arguments are pathetic, he talks about atmosphere being worse, then tries to disprove it by mentioning 3 or 4 games in 20 years. HE also advocates being stupidly over emotional, because of what the he think the Germans would do. Other than the kids thing (and kids can sit in the family stand) all of his concerns are addressed by the German model. He needs to stop living in the past.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°195
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Mon Mar 28, 2011 1:52 am
ResurrectionRooney wrote:It is 21 years since Lord Justice Taylor's report recommended that terracing at football grounds should be outlawed. The move was a direct response to the tragedy at Hillsborough, where 96 people went to a football match and never returned home.
The passing of time should not be allowed to diminish the reasons behind the introduction of all-seater stadiums, which is why I'm instinctively and deeply opposed to the reintroduction of standing areas at grounds.
The subject is back on the agenda with a fans' group setting up a petition supporting the idea and Sports Minister Hugh Robertson not wanting to appear dismissive, saying he will view it seriously.
I'm more in line with the Premier League stance that the benefits of all-seater stadiums far outweigh the advantages of having supporters standing in big crowds.
From where I'm looking, the introduction of all-seater stadiums has worked. To change it, even now, is an unnecessary risk, a view only strengthened when I remember what happened at Hillsborough and what the families of the bereaved have had to endure in the months and years since then.
For younger readers nationally who don't know the story, I was the Liverpool manager when many of our supporters were crushed to death after an area of terracing at Hillsborough became overcrowded before our FA Cup semi-final against Nottingham Forest in 1989.
Football has become a far safer sport for supporters since both terracing and fencing around the pitch were banished. There are fewer injuries and there is less hooliganism, too. It can't be wrong.
I've heard it argued that people are denied the right to make a choice between sitting and standing but if you asked people what the safer option would be, they would say sitting.
And safety is not something you should take for granted. If we are safer now, it is because the recommendations of the Taylor Report were acted upon.
The other point I've heard mentioned is that all-seater stadiums are bad for atmosphere. Even if that were true, would it not be right to sacrifice a little bit of atmosphere for safety? I don't think the argument about atmosphere is correct anyway. You can't deny that there have been some absolutely fantastic nights at Anfield since the stadium went all-seater.
Yes, the famous Saint Etienne European Cup game in 1977 when you could squeeze 26,000 into the old Kop was played in a marvellous atmosphere. But it was also extremely good against Olympiakos in 2004 when Steven Gerrard rattled one in to take Liverpool through against the odds.
People talk with some reverence about the 2005 semi-final against Chelsea when the noise and passion were incredible and sucked Luis Garcia's shot over the line. Remember, that was in an all-seater stadium.
It isn't just Anfield. I went to a Celtic-Rangers Old Firm game in the Scottish Premier League last month that Celtic won 3-0 and you couldn't tell me the atmosphere would have been any better had people all been standing and swaying on the terraces. Not a chance – it was fantastic as it was.
Maybe some other grounds don't have that old-fashioned atmosphere any more but if the reward is that mothers and fathers can take their children there in safety, that's surely not a bad thing. I'd certainly be more inclined to take my son or daughter - or grandchildren nowadays! - to a match where you sit rather than stand.
The one drawback about modern stadiums over the last 20 years which I have to accept is the increased cost in going to games.
I acknowledge that it would be fantastic to make it more affordable for the man in the street to go to matches with his kids. I don't agree a return to standing is the right way to do that but I do think we all have to find a way to make sure not every seat is expensive.
I know fans still stand in countries like Germany. But you can't compare their situation with ours. If Germany had endured a tragedy like Hillsborough, of innocent supporters dying because they went to a football match, they would have banned standing and they would not now be talking of reversing that decision.
-----------
What a fucking dinosaur, his arguments are pathetic, he talks about atmosphere being worse, then tries to disprove it by mentioning 3 or 4 games in 20 years. HE also advocates being stupidly over emotional, because of what the he think the Germans would do. Other than the kids thing (and kids can sit in the family stand) all of his concerns are addressed by the German model. He needs to stop living in the past.
Why dont you go fuck yourself he is intitled to his opinion just like you are.
ResurrectionRooney-
- Posts : 17681
Supports : United
- Post n°196
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by ResurrectionRooney Mon Mar 28, 2011 1:57 am
Liverpool fc 4 ever wrote:
Why dont you go fuck yourself he is intitled to his opinion just like you are.
He is absolutely entitled to his opinion, and I am entitled to have an opinion that he is totally wrong.
Guest- Guest
- Post n°197
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by Guest Mon Mar 28, 2011 2:00 am
ResurrectionRooney wrote:Liverpool fc 4 ever wrote:
Why dont you go fuck yourself he is intitled to his opinion just like you are.
He is absolutely entitled to his opinion, and I am entitled to have an opinion that he is totally wrong.
Is that cause he was or is not involved with Manchester.United.
ResurrectionRooney-
- Posts : 17681
Supports : United
- Post n°198
Re: Should standing areas return to our top football grounds?
by ResurrectionRooney Mon Mar 28, 2011 2:42 am
Liverpool fc 4 ever wrote:ResurrectionRooney wrote:Liverpool fc 4 ever wrote:
Why dont you go fuck yourself he is intitled to his opinion just like you are.
He is absolutely entitled to his opinion, and I am entitled to have an opinion that he is totally wrong.
Is that cause he was or is not involved with Manchester.United.
Er...no, it's because I disagree with him, as I have expressed in this thread.
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