Lux wrote:
Ideally, yes. If the reason for removing him is because of this then for me that's not right.
Then that is something we totally disagree on. I do not see the captaincy as sacred as to only be broken by being found guilty of a crime.
Whether Terry is guilty or not should matter to the FA. The reality, as you call it, is that Terry is innocent until proven guilty. Every player for England is an ambassador, so people will be calling for him to be axed from the team too.
Although every player represents the country, the captain is the one that would in most cases be considered "the main man". There will be calls for him being axed, but not nearly as much as it would be if he was captain. Axing him would be wrong given the current status of the case, and the FA have acknowledged that, but removing his captaincy reduces tensions and speculation considerably.
I don't know what your principles are, but what I do see is that you either completely misinterpret, ignore or just find irrelevant quite a lot of my points. By doing that and continuing to exaggerate points which I find not as important, whilst also not even so much as acknowledging other points (e.g. that the England captaincy is just political/marketing...that's just wrong on many levels). Don't take it personally, it's just frustrating for me and you probably don't mean it.
Please tell me what I have exaggerated.
I'm not saying the captaincy doesn't entail more, but I personally can not disregard those factors. Even without the captaincy he can still be a leader in defence, he just doens't have to be the one who speaks for the team and thus England in my opinion.
Capello did not want Terry to be stripped by the FA, and he probably wouldn't have either. Capello is the manager so.he would want to make the decision. Does it benefit Terry? No way. He has handled the media incredibly well, and I know that he won't appreciate this, because he obviously is a proud person and it means a lot to him. He has been through a lot and has ever distracted him? No.
Capello would have had to make a decision eventually. This way the pressure on him is significantly reduced.
It does benefit John Terry in the sense that media pressure will be considerablly less, and his involvement with the team will be less scrutinized. A new captain reduces the chances of a press-conference being derailed by the "John Terry issue", and reduces his exposure to the media in high-pressure situations.
Organisations can attack him, they can attack the FA, they could attack Capello. Do you think either Capello or Terry care? Are they supposed to be sorry and cater to these organisations needs? All things aside, I care more about the manager and the captain (who is one of our best and most influential players) then some groups who I don't care about. Not saying that I don't commend anti racism groups for their efforts to stop racism....but this isn't the same. If they attack Terry then they're in the wrong.
Do you think they won't be effected? Do you honestly think that after the umpteenth question about Terry's "mentality" they won't be effected at all? How about the rest of the team? Are they as strong minded as Terry? When everyone bombards Terry, when his position gets questioned time and time again, do you really think every player has the mind-set to ignore it?
His influence isn't removed because the captaincy is removed. They didn't kick him out of the team, so he can be just as much of an influence on the pitch as he could before. Capello has said it many times, you need more than one leader on the pitch. If Terry can't be a leader without the captaincy then something is terribly wrong with his mentality.
That's those people's faults for assuming that they know everything. They dismiss reality by making their minds up that Terry is guilty. Is it a reality? (yet...) No. Terry doesn't benefit at all from this, he loses everything, even if he is found innocent.
No one has gone out and said that Terry is guilty. He's not being removed for being pressumed guilty, he's being removed because there's too much controversy surrounding the position.
I can't see how he loses anyhting at all. If he is found innocent then he gets vindication over the media, and those who thought he was guilty. His position was not removed because he is definitely a "racist", it was removed because that is what is best for the team, for England and for the FA.
It should be. If Terry is found not guilty, then I would feel it only fair that he seeks huge damages from all parties such as Anton Ferdinand for false accusation, all the groups attacking Terry for defamation, and the FA too.
Diagree completely. He can not seek damages from any group as none of them have said he is guilty. No one has gone out and pressumed his guilt. Nor can he sue the FA as all they have done is remove a controversial captain from his position and even specified that they do not pressume guilt. He can sue a few papers, but that's about it.
So you automatically assume Anton Ferdinand is guilty of false accusation if he's found innocent then? He couldn't simply have missheard it, or missunderstood it?
It's a joke that people can assume that you can accuse someone of something so big, and ignore the fact that if he is found innocent...then obviously the people who accused him and took it so far should be held responsible, and suffer the same kind of consequences that Terry would if he was found guilty.
So in your eyes if he is found guilty the legal system should face the same abuse as Terry has? They should be fined 2.5k for doing their job? Anton Ferdinand is not on the side of the prosection, he's a witness. He's not the accuser. It's not "John Terry vs Anton Ferdiand".
What is worse? Calling someone a "black cunt", something which doesn't necessarily make Terry racist...or ruining a person's reputation, publicly abusing and humiliating them, falsely accusing him of committing a crime, perverting the course of justice, all the costs incurred etc etc...?
Please stop making it one man vs another when every document filed shows that Anton Ferdinand is just a witness in this case. He can sue the papers if he wants to, but anyone else is entirely without guilt in that regard.
If Terry is found not guilty, then Anton Ferdinand is a villain, not a victim....which is what Terry would be.
Anton Ferdinand is nothing more than a witness. He is not gaining anything from the case, and he is not suing Terry. He's listed as a witness, on line with every other witness in the case, his position is only special because people believe it to be.
