Are Barcelona just Arsenal + Messi?

So James, are you saying that weaker players wouldn't make it in the Premier League?

But some of the best players in the League are the so called 'smaller and weaker' players.

Examples off the top of my head of players with a similar build to Messi.

Nasri
Fabregas
Nani
Suarez
Modric
Lennon
Benayoun
Arshavin
Van Der Vaart

Also, when Ronaldo went to Man United, he was a skinny little show pony. But the Premier League + intensive weight training beefed him up and turned him into the player he is now.

Your argument sucks, because there are plenty of smaller/weaker players already in the EPL and have done very well.

What? I'm not arguing about the strength of a player.


I am asking if Arsenal had that special player would they be a top club like Barca and would Barca be less succesful without Messi.

James ♠ wrote:What? I'm not arguing about the strength of a player.


I am asking if Arsenal had that special player would they be a top club like Barca and would Barca be less succesful without Messi.

It wasn't aimed at the OP it was aimed at the little debate going on over the last couple pages.

I think the best possible answer to your question is this ..

Messi moving to Arsenal would improve Arsenal more than it would impair Barcelona.

Barcelona are Arsenal plus Puyol, Pique, Alves, Iniesta, Busquets, Xavi, Villa and Messi

Not really, All you've done is post the players for the same position, and while some have the same play style, one from a team is on another level than one from another.

Exactly, meaning Barca are far superior than ArseHole

I2eds_AVA wrote:Exactly, meaning Barca are far superior than ArseHole

*Awaits an essay from an arsenal fan*

James ♠ wrote:I've always wondered. If Messi was taken out of Barcelona would they be succesful? The amount of goals Messi creates or scores with dribbling is pretty high.


Valdes = Polish lad
Alves = Sagna
Puyol + Pique = Djourou + Koscielny
Abidal/Maxell = Clichy
Biscuit = Song
Xavi = Fabregas
Iniesta = Nasri
Pedro = Arshavin??
Villa = RVP

Which means Walcott plays where Messi would. If these 2 swapped teams would Arsenal have success like Barcelona and would Barcelona be nearly men just like Arsenal?

Discuss.

EDIT: The = is not players ability, just general positions within the team. Both play a basic 4-3-3/4-2-3-1

No, Barca without Messi is still stronger. I don't think any Arsenal player could make it into Barca's starting XI. Fabregas might, but it's still not clear. The problem with Barca is if you somehow stop Messi, there are still 3-4 other dangerous players you need to keep at bay.

No Barca are much better than Arsenal.

Eboue would.

I2eds_AVA wrote:Barcelona are Arsenal plus Puyol, Pique, Alves, Iniesta, Busquets, Xavi, Villa and Messi

Don't forget Pedro.

I hate Pedro but people underrate him.

and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos > Alves
Pepe > Pique
Carvalho > Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira > Busquets
Xabi = Xavi
Özil > Iniesta
Di Maria > Pedro
Higuaín = Villa
Ronaldo > Messi

Ozil same as Iniesta? Fuck off

Yeah damn I was thinking about changing that one as: Özil > Iniesta.

El Pipita wrote:and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos < Alves
Pepe < Pique
Carvalho < Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira < Busquets
Xabi < Xavi
Özil < Iniesta
Di Maria < Pedro
Higuaín < Villa
Ronaldo < Messi

I'd say you have a better left-back and a better keeper, but that's it.

El Pipita wrote:and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos > Alves
Pepe > Pique
Carvalho > Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira > Busquets
Xabi = Xavi
Özil > Iniesta
Di Maria > Pedro
Higuaín = Villa
Ronaldo > Messi

Retard alert. I wasn't comparing players skills to each other. Learn to read you ugly Belgian cunt.

El Pipita wrote:and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos > Alves
Pepe > Pique
Carvalho > Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira > Busquets
Xabi = Xavi
Özil > Iniesta
Di Maria > Pedro
Higuaín = Villa
Ronaldo > Messi

Beautiful

James ♠ wrote:

El Pipita wrote:and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos > Alves
Pepe > Pique
Carvalho > Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira > Busquets
Xabi = Xavi
Özil > Iniesta
Di Maria > Pedro
Higuaín = Villa
Ronaldo > Messi

Retard alert. I wasn't comparing players skills to each other. Learn to read you ugly Belgian cunt.

What were you comparing? They don't play the same positions either if that's what you meant...

Thats what I was trying to say. Both teams have the flat back 4 with holding mid. 2 central mids with the 2 wingers and 1 man up top although that usually = 3 up top.

I same positions but slightly different roles obviously


The obvious mistake I made was not putting Wilshere in for Arshavin and swapping that position.

Don't really agree tbh, but maybe I'm looking at it in too much detail. Barcelona don't really have a man up top. It's more like Messi as a false 9(ie much deeper than the usual leading striker) with Pedro and Villa coming in from the wings. Busquets plays deeper than Song, Alves and Maxwell play more advanced than Arsenals fullbacks too.

Barca are more flexible.. I think a lot of the time on the pitch they look like this:


With Villa and Pedro moving out wide a bit more and Messi making runs forward.. also Alves is in the other team's half most of the time.

When you look in detail it's different to Arsenal's.. but I still get what James is saying.

So basically the thread is just to state that Barcelona and Arsenal play the same basic position?

I don't really know.

Arsenal and Barcelona have similarities, but that's about it.

El Pipita wrote:and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos > Alves
Pepe > Pique
Carvalho > Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira > Busquets
Xabi = Xavi
Özil > Iniesta
Di Maria > Pedro
Higuaín = Villa
Ronaldo > Messi

I'd rather my team win 5-0 than have "better players"

I2eds_AVA wrote:Ozil same as Iniesta? Fuck off

This.

El Pipita wrote:and theres only one team that has better players than Barca here it goes:
Casillas > Valdes
Ramos > Alves
Pepe > Pique
Carvalho > Puyol
Marcelo > Abidal
Khedira > Busquets
Xabi = Xavi
Özil > Iniesta
Di Maria > Pedro
Higuaín = Villa
Ronaldo > Messi

And yet they still Smash you 5-0

That is because we let them.

We?

He's saving Eggzon the hassle of replying.