Manchester United FC Official Thread

Ridiculous decision to send off Nani.

No it wasn't.

Danny wrote:Except for the part where it wasn't really like De Jong's at all...

Looked pretty comfortable with 11 on the pitch, Madrid not really creating a lot. Nani's red changed that, Modric/Alonso had too much space (Giggs or Welbeck is on Modric for both goals, no doubt, if we had 11 men on). Still created the better/more chances even with 10 men, if you want to be proud of anything.

He raised his foot very high, that's a yellow, he then connected with an opposing player in the ribs/abdomen, that's a red.

It was not as bad as De Jong's.

That's probably because De Jong's tackle is one of the worst challenges ever to disgrace a football match.

SBSP wrote:It was not as bad as De Jong's.

That is not relevant at all.

dena wrote:

Danny wrote:Except for the part where it wasn't really like De Jong's at all...

Looked pretty comfortable with 11 on the pitch, Madrid not really creating a lot. Nani's red changed that, Modric/Alonso had too much space (Giggs or Welbeck is on Modric for both goals, no doubt, if we had 11 men on). Still created the better/more chances even with 10 men, if you want to be proud of anything.

He raised his foot very high, that's a yellow, he then connected with an opposing player in the ribs/abdomen, that's a red.

It wasnt a red.

You have to take into account that it was the Real Madrid player that ran into Nanis foot.

Not Nani kicking the other player.

20Legend wrote:

dena wrote:

He raised his foot very high, that's a yellow, he then connected with an opposing player in the ribs/abdomen, that's a red.

It wasnt a red.

You have to take into account that it was the Real Madrid player that ran into Nanis foot.

Not Nani kicking the other player.

Yup. Nani didn't even know he was there. Nani had his eye on the ball, was clearly attempting to play the ball and he had as much right to it as the Real Madrid player. Extremely harsh call. And it totally decided the game.

Grenade wrote:

20Legend wrote:Absolute fucking disgrace .
Ref is a cheating fucking cunt.
Cheated again.

Better team lost.

Is Jose Mourinho crying then? He expressed similar sentiments (i.e. that the better team lost).

dangerous play. Deserved the red but damn, man utd were the better team.

Childish Logic wrote:dangerous play. Deserved the red but damn, man utd were the better team.

Then anytime a guy tries to play the ball while it's still above waist-height is dangerous and red card worthy. We can expect 7 to 10 red cards per game.

Jumped with his foot way too high. That is clearly dangerous and this doesn't happen 10 times a game.

C'mon it's a yellow.

What else is he meant to do? People would have been fucking furious if he lets Arebloa take that down and burst past him.

Football's gone to shit if that's a red card. Joke of a decision.

Danny wrote:What else is he meant to do? People would have been fucking furious if he lets Arebloa take that down and burst past him. :l
Football's gone to shit if that's a red card. Joke of a decision.

Exactly. If that's a red what it means is that anytime the ball is above your waist, you better not play it because if somebody comes from a blind spot and runs into your foot you're off.

Connecting with studs in the stomach somehow isn't dangerous play, lel.

@R_o_M: Is it too much to ask that people actually read the Laws of the game before giving their opinion on Nani's red card? http://t.co/5MKa0rAHuC

Reckless, no excessive force. Yellow card.

Zzonked wrote:Connecting with studs in the stomach somehow isn't dangerous play, lel.

So nobody should ever attempt to play the ball with their feet while it is above the waist because if another player comes from your blind spot and runs into your foot, you're off.

If a player doesn't know what's there it's immensely reckless to throw your boot up that high and he deserves everything he gets. Nobody should attempt to play the ball like that unless they know they're going to get the ball.

Intent has nothing to do with it, his boot connected with another players stomach, that's dangerous play, that's a red.

Zzonked wrote:If a player doesn't know what's there it's immensely reckless to throw your boot up that high and he deserves everything he gets. Nobody should attempt to play the ball like that unless they know they're going to get the ball.

Intent has nothing to do with it, his boot connected with another players stomach, that's dangerous play, that's a red.

A yellow card then.

It could have been a yellow, it's probably 50/50, but as the law says:

A player is guilty of serious foul play if he uses excessive force or
brutality against an opponent when challenging for the ball when it is
in play." It clarifies: "Excessive force means that the player has far
exceeded the necessary use of force and is in danger of injuring his
opponent."

I think the ref is fully entitled to send him off. He's decided that it wasn't necessary force and he was in danger of injuring Arbeloa, which isn't exactly a whacked out decision.

Zzonked wrote:If a player doesn't know what's there it's immensely reckless to throw your boot up that high and he deserves everything he gets. Nobody should attempt to play the ball like that unless they know they're going to get the ball.

Intent has nothing to do with it, his boot connected with another players stomach, that's dangerous play, that's a red.

By definition, you never know who is in your blind spot. So I take you agree with the assertion that a player should never play a ball with his feet that is above the waist because a player could come from his blind spot and run into his foot?

Zzonked wrote:It could have been a yellow, it's probably 50/50, but as the law says:

A player is guilty of serious foul play if he uses excessive force or
brutality against an opponent when challenging for the ball when it is
in play." It clarifies: "Excessive force means that the player has far
exceeded the necessary use of force and is in danger of injuring his
opponent."

I think the ref is fully entitled to send him off. He's decided that it wasn't necessary force and he was in danger of injuring Arbeloa, which isn't exactly a whacked out decision.

How did he exceed the necessary use of force when all he did was try to play the ball? Could he have used less force than he did given the location of the ball? The implication of what you are saying here is that Nani was obliged to let the ball fall to Arbeloa.

menalawyerguy wrote:

Zzonked wrote:It could have been a yellow, it's probably 50/50, but as the law says:

A player is guilty of serious foul play if he uses excessive force or
brutality against an opponent when challenging for the ball when it is
in play." It clarifies: "Excessive force means that the player has far
exceeded the necessary use of force and is in danger of injuring his
opponent."

I think the ref is fully entitled to send him off. He's decided that it wasn't necessary force and he was in danger of injuring Arbeloa, which isn't exactly a whacked out decision.

How did he exceed the necessary use of force when all he did was try to play the ball? Could he have used less force than he did given the location of the ball? The implication of what you are saying here is that Nani was obliged to let the ball fall to Arbeloa.

Yes, he was obliged to let it fall to Arbeloa. Strangely enough there are times when you actually can't legally get the ball on a football pitch without committing a foul.

Suarez could only reach the ball with his hand in the world cup, does that mean he's obliged to let it fall into the net? Yes.

Zzonked wrote:

menalawyerguy wrote:

How did he exceed the necessary use of force when all he did was try to play the ball? Could he have used less force than he did given the location of the ball? The implication of what you are saying here is that Nani was obliged to let the ball fall to Arbeloa.

Yes, he was obliged to let it fall to Arbeloa. Strangely enough there are times when you actually can't legally get the ball on a football pitch without committing a foul.

We're not talking about a mere foul; we're talking about a straight red.

Suarez could only reach the ball with his hand in the world cup, does that mean he's obliged to let it fall into the net? Yes.

Correct, but Nani had no idea that there was another player that close to the play. So why should he have felt obliged to let it fall? I take it then that you do in fact agree that a player should never play a ball that is above his waist with his feet because a player might come from his blind spot and run into his foot.

They shouldn't do it if they have no idea what's there, no.

Nowhere in the rules does it mention intent. It's not the referee's job to decide whether it's on purpose or not.

Zzonked wrote:They shouldn't do it if they have no idea what's there, no.

Which, by definition, a player never will. That's why it's called a"blind spot."

Nowhere in the rules does it mention intent. It's not the referee's job to decide whether it's on purpose or not.

Nor did anybody claim that it is.

The 'blind spot' argument implies intent matters. Him having that blind spot makes no difference to if he stared him straight down and did the same thing, because intent isn't mentioned.

Zzonked wrote:The 'blind spot' argument implies intent matters. Him having that blind spot makes no difference to if he stared him straight down and did the same thing, because intent isn't mentioned.

The blind spot is about what a player knows and thus, it goes directly to ascertaining what can be deemed "unnecessary" use of force. It's not unnecessary use of force if a player doesn't know another player is right there. Nani might have seen the spin of the ball and concluded that once it hit the ground, it would spin away from him and thus compromise his ability to obtain possession. He didn't lash out violently at the ball. He just went up with his foot to play the ball in the air before it hit the ground. That may be reckless but it's not unnecessary use of force.

Changed how he read out the two teams. Usually away side first in squad number order. Read out us first, then saved Ronaldo till last.