The Great Palestinian Lie

I don't agree fully with some of the things he said about the Koran and Islam in general, but for actually stating the truth about Palestine.

The Palestinians DO NOT want to negotiate. Simple as. They want Israel eliminated from the map.

Speaks well doesn't he.

What a load of BS. This guy is as stupid as RR, so it's no surprise he looks up to him. He thinks a bunch of terrorists represent the views of all Palestinians. I laughed hard when he suggested that Western media is pro-Palestinian.

Most Palestinians want peace and a two state solution. Suggesting that Palestinians don't want peace is like suggesting Israeli's don't want peace either. http://www.haaretz.com/news/poll-most-palestinians-israelis-want-two-state-solution-1.274607

It's impossible to have peace talks when the other part is continually building illegal settlements and slowly increasing their territory. It's like expecting you to make peace with me while I'm punching you. No matter how you look at it, this conflict wasn't created or fueled by hatred of Jews. It's mostly a political issue, not a religious one.

ahlycotc wrote:What a load of BS. This guy is as stupid as RR, so it's no surprise he looks up to him. He thinks a bunch of terrorists represent the views of all Palestinians. I laughed hard when he suggested that Western media is pro-Palestinian.

That is generally the conclusion when the majority voted for a terrorist organization to lead their state.

polska. wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:What a load of BS. This guy is as stupid as RR, so it's no surprise he looks up to him. He thinks a bunch of terrorists represent the views of all Palestinians. I laughed hard when he suggested that Western media is pro-Palestinian.

That is generally the conclusion when the majority voted for a terrorist organization to lead their state.

Israelis and Americans vote in terrorist governments all the time.

ahlycotc wrote:

polska. wrote:

That is generally the conclusion when the majority voted for a terrorist organization to lead their state.

Israelis and Americans vote in terrorist governments all the time.

How can you expect us to take you seriously when you come out with utter shit like this?

Because you can't handle the truth. Do you honestly think that the Israeli and US governments have never engaged in acts of terror?

ahlycotc wrote:Because you can't handle the truth. Do you honestly think that the Israeli and US governments have never engaged in acts of terror?

Are you claiming that the Republican and Democratic parties in the United States are terrorist organisations?

ResurrectionRooney wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:Because you can't handle the truth. Do you honestly think that the Israeli and US governments have never engaged in acts of terror?

Are you claiming that the Republican and Democratic parties in the United States are terrorist organisations?

It's no so much the parties, but the government organizations. By definition, some US government organizations have committed acts of terror. It's not a surprise really, there are many governments around the world that engage in acts of terror.

ahlycotc wrote:

ResurrectionRooney wrote:

Are you claiming that the Republican and Democratic parties in the United States are terrorist organisations?

It's no so much the parties, but the government organizations. By definition, some US government organizations have committed acts of terror. It's not a surprise really, there are many governments around the world that engage in acts of terror.

It's just plain retarded and youre totally grasping for straws by saying the government of the United States, a country in which you are allowed to live, is a terrorist organization just the same as the terrorists who run the Palestinians.

Also, as you say it's tough to negotiate when the Israelis are building settlements in....now read this....is THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They can build wherever they want.

You know what makes it tough to negotiate and take the terrorist/Palestinians seriously? Continuously launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods and sending suicide bombers into highly populated areas such as markets. The Palestinians don't deserve their own country. That's right I said it.

Mustangt125 wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:

It's no so much the parties, but the government organizations. By definition, some US government organizations have committed acts of terror. It's not a surprise really, there are many governments around the world that engage in acts of terror.

It's just plain retarded and youre totally grasping for straws by saying the government of the United States, a country in which you are allowed to live, is a terrorist organization just the same as the terrorists who run the Palestinians.

Also, as you say it's tough to negotiate when the Israelis are building settlements in....now read this....is THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They can build wherever they want.

You know what makes it tough to negotiate and take the terrorist/Palestinians seriously? Continuously launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods and sending suicide bombers into highly populated areas such as markets. The Palestinians don't deserve their own country. That's right I said it.

They're building illegal settlements in the Gaza Strip, you idiot. That isn't their country. You've got to be the most ignorant member on this forum.

BladeGunner14 wrote:

Mustangt125 wrote:

It's just plain retarded and youre totally grasping for straws by saying the government of the United States, a country in which you are allowed to live, is a terrorist organization just the same as the terrorists who run the Palestinians.

Also, as you say it's tough to negotiate when the Israelis are building settlements in....now read this....is THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They can build wherever they want.

You know what makes it tough to negotiate and take the terrorist/Palestinians seriously? Continuously launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods and sending suicide bombers into highly populated areas such as markets. The Palestinians don't deserve their own country. That's right I said it.

They're building illegal settlements in the Gaza Strip, you idiot. That isn't their country. You've got to be the most ignorant member on this forum.

They pulled all settlements out of the Gaza strip, you idiot.

The West Bank is part of Israel, Israel is allowed to settle their own land. If the Majority of the West Bank want independence, then fair enough. But what I find disturbing is that any Palestinian government would actually exterminate and deport an entire population of Israeli's out of their homes in any then-controlled Palestinian territories. Last time that happened ANYWHERE in the world, was when the Soviets deported the Germans out of Poland, Czech Republic and Kalingrad, and the Poles out of Lithuania/Belarus/Ukraine and the Romanians out of Basarabia. How could you agree with that? How can anyone agree wit that? If Turkey decided one day to deport all the Kurds into Iraq, the whole fucking world would have a huge hissy fit.

Mustangt125 wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:

It's no so much the parties, but the government organizations. By definition, some US government organizations have committed acts of terror. It's not a surprise really, there are many governments around the world that engage in acts of terror.

It's just plain retarded and youre totally grasping for straws by saying the government of the United States, a country in which you are allowed to live, is a terrorist organization just the same as the terrorists who run the Palestinians.

Also, as you say it's tough to negotiate when the Israelis are building settlements in....now read this....is THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They can build wherever they want.

You know what makes it tough to negotiate and take the terrorist/Palestinians seriously? Continuously launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods and sending suicide bombers into highly populated areas such as markets. The Palestinians don't deserve their own country. That's right I said it.

How am I clutching at straws? Defend your argument that the US has never engaged in acts of terror. I respect the fact that you love your country as any person should love their own country. However, it becomes sad when that person can't accept the facts and ignores problems created by that country.

It's not their country. They are Palestinian territories. The whole world including the USA have condemned Israel for building ILLEGAL settlements. This isn't coming from just an Arab.

By the way, do you know why rockets are launched in Israel? Surely, it's not for the fun of it. They are retaliating to Israel which in turn retaliates with a much greater force and use of illegal chemical weapons.

ahlycotc wrote:

Mustangt125 wrote:

It's just plain retarded and youre totally grasping for straws by saying the government of the United States, a country in which you are allowed to live, is a terrorist organization just the same as the terrorists who run the Palestinians.

Also, as you say it's tough to negotiate when the Israelis are building settlements in....now read this....is THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They can build wherever they want.

You know what makes it tough to negotiate and take the terrorist/Palestinians seriously? Continuously launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods and sending suicide bombers into highly populated areas such as markets. The Palestinians don't deserve their own country. That's right I said it.

How am I clutching at straws? Defend your argument that the US has never engaged in acts of terror. I respect the fact that you love your country as any person should love their own country. However, it becomes sad when that person can't accept the facts and ignores problems created by that country.

oh the irony.

By the way, do you know why rockets are launched in Israel? Surely, it's not for the fun of it. They are retaliating to Israel which in turn retaliates with a much greater force and use of illegal chemical weapons.

Israel used chemical weapons? When?

As far as I know, they were one of the countries that pushed the UN to banning the use of chemical weapons because lots of Arab and Middle Eastern nations used chemical weapons, like Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Libya and Syria, as well as many Muslim Terrorist organizations in the Middle East, like Al-Qaeda, Hezbollah, Fatah, and surprise surprise, Hamas who currently lead the Palestinian nation.

polska. wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:

How am I clutching at straws? Defend your argument that the US has never engaged in acts of terror. I respect the fact that you love your country as any person should love their own country. However, it becomes sad when that person can't accept the facts and ignores problems created by that country.

oh the irony.

By the way, do you know why rockets are launched in Israel? Surely, it's not for the fun of it. They are retaliating to Israel which in turn retaliates with a much greater force and use of illegal chemical weapons.

Israel used chemical weapons? When?

As far as I know, they were one of the countries that pushed the UN to banning the use of chemical weapons because lots of Arab and Middle Eastern nations used chemical weapons, like Yemen, Iraq, Iran, Libya and Syria, as well as many Muslim Terrorist organizations in the Middle East, like Al-Qaeda, Hezbollah, Fatah, and surprise surprise, Hamas who currently lead the Palestinian nation.

What's the irony in it?

Yes, Israel used chemical weapons including white phosphorous, which was made illegal in 1980. They last used 3-4 years ago in Gaza. They also used it in Lebanon in 2006. It melts flesh to the bone and causes poison.

Here is a photo of the damage on a Lebanese child.
WARNING: not for the faint of heart

Spoiler:

I can't actually tell which part is what..

And there is proof it is Israel at fault for the Lebanese war? Not Hezbollah?

polska. wrote:

BladeGunner14 wrote:

They're building illegal settlements in the Gaza Strip, you idiot. That isn't their country. You've got to be the most ignorant member on this forum.

They pulled all settlements out of the Gaza strip, you idiot.

The West Bank is part of Israel, Israel is allowed to settle their own land. If the Majority of the West Bank want independence, then fair enough. But what I find disturbing is that any Palestinian government would actually exterminate and deport an entire population of Israeli's out of their homes in any then-controlled Palestinian territories. Last time that happened ANYWHERE in the world, was when the Soviets deported the Germans out of Poland, Czech Republic and Kalingrad, and the Poles out of Lithuania/Belarus/Ukraine and the Romanians out of Basarabia. How could you agree with that? How can anyone agree wit that? If Turkey decided one day to deport all the Kurds into Iraq, the whole fucking world would have a huge hissy fit.

I actually was just referring to his quote, nothing more, nothing less.

polska. wrote:And there is proof it is Israel at fault for the Lebanese war? Not Hezbollah?

Look at who is clutching at straws now. I present you with clear evidence of illegal acts perpetuated by a terrorist state and you try to claim that it's Hezbollah's fault! What a sick human being you are for suggesting the use of chemical and illegal weapons is ok if in self defense.

ahlycotc wrote:

polska. wrote:And there is proof it is Israel at fault for the Lebanese war? Not Hezbollah?

Look at who is clutching at straws now. I present you with clear evidence of illegal acts perpetuated by a terrorist state and you try to claim that it's Hezbollah's fault! What a sick human being you are for suggesting the use of chemical and illegal weapons is ok if in self defense.

I never claimed such.

All I asked is whether the White Phosphorus was used by Hezbollah or Israel?

Besides, it is all meaningless. We can go on forever at who is more wrong. Both are wrong. We can however discuss the solution.

polska. wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:

Look at who is clutching at straws now. I present you with clear evidence of illegal acts perpetuated by a terrorist state and you try to claim that it's Hezbollah's fault! What a sick human being you are for suggesting the use of chemical and illegal weapons is ok if in self defense.

I never claimed such.

All I asked is whether the White Phosphorus was used by Hezbollah or Israel?

Besides, it is all meaningless. We can go on forever at who is more wrong. Both are wrong. We can however discuss the solution.

Your post clearly asked if Israel or Hezbollah was at fault for the WAR, not usage of white phosphorus. But to answer your question, it was used by Israel. Hezbollah has no access to white phosphorus.

Your last statement is what I've been saying all along. There is no use to moan about the past, we need to find a solution for the future. Building illegal settlements and continuing to use illegal weapons is not tool for peace. I've already presented my solution before...

1) Egypt brokers a peace between Hammas and Fatah, unifying the Palestinian people. (January 2012)
2) Free and fair elections are held and a sole government represents all Palestinian people. (June 2012)
3) Palestine becomes an official state with total control over its territories (based on the 1967 borders) and population. (December 2012)
4) The world ends.

Seriously though, Palestine has to have full control over its territories and become an official state. Only then can you have meaningful negotiations with Israel. At that time, if Hamas is the sole representative of Palestine and decides to use force against Israel, Israel will have every right to declare war on Palestine (as long as they don't use illegal weapons again). At that time, Israel can legitimately annex Palestinian land through means of war.

Israel only uses weapons permitted by International Law. It uses White Phosphorous for the wholly legal purpose of masking the use of it's troops on the battlefield by creating smoke.

If a third party (like Egypt) came along and dissolved Fatah and Hamas, and an actual political party rather than terrorist organization came to rule Palestine and seek a peace solution that suits both parties, then that is the way to go.

I would rather it be this way as any terrorist attacks by Palestine onto Israel can be seen as a declaration of war, and thus allowing Israel's counter-measures to be legal.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Israel only uses weapons permitted by International Law. It uses White Phosphorous for the wholly legal purpose of masking the use of it's troops on the battlefield by creating smoke.

Of course Israel won't admit to using illegal weapons. Why would they use white phosphorus in densely populated areas knowing very well that there will be civilian casualties? If you want to use white phosphorus for those reasons, you don't do it in civilian areas.

When confronted early in the Lebanon war, Israel denied the use of white phosphorus several times. Later, they admitted its use and stopped using it. If they were using it in legal matters, why would they hide it in the beginning? Not to mention the use of white phosphorus on a UN building in Gaza.

I don't see why you stick up to Israel so much and can't admit they have done horrible things. Is it because they are fighting Muslims?

polska. wrote:If a third party (like Egypt) came along and dissolved Fatah and Hamas, and an actual political party rather than terrorist organization came to rule Palestine and seek a peace solution that suits both parties, then that is the way to go.

I would rather it be this way as any terrorist attacks by Palestine onto Israel can be seen as a declaration of war, and thus allowing Israel's counter-measures to be legal.

And I'm fine with that.

ahlycotc wrote:

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Israel only uses weapons permitted by International Law. It uses White Phosphorous for the wholly legal purpose of masking the use of it's troops on the battlefield by creating smoke.

Of course Israel won't admit to using illegal weapons. Why would they use white phosphorus in densely populated areas knowing very well that there will be civilian casualties? If you want to use white phosphorus for those reasons, you don't do it in civilian areas.

When confronted early in the Lebanon war, Israel denied the use of white phosphorus several times. Later, they admitted its use and stopped using it. If they were using it in legal matters, why would they hide it in the beginning? Not to mention the use of white phosphorus on a UN building in Gaza.

I don't see why you stick up to Israel so much and can't admit they have done horrible things. Is it because they are fighting Muslims?

No, it's because they are fighting terrorism, and fighting people who are trying to kick them off their land. Judaism is about as bad as Islam in my eyes. If, if, they used chemical weapons then I condemn that, but that doesn't make it a terrorist state.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:

ahlycotc wrote:

Of course Israel won't admit to using illegal weapons. Why would they use white phosphorus in densely populated areas knowing very well that there will be civilian casualties? If you want to use white phosphorus for those reasons, you don't do it in civilian areas.

When confronted early in the Lebanon war, Israel denied the use of white phosphorus several times. Later, they admitted its use and stopped using it. If they were using it in legal matters, why would they hide it in the beginning? Not to mention the use of white phosphorus on a UN building in Gaza.

I don't see why you stick up to Israel so much and can't admit they have done horrible things. Is it because they are fighting Muslims?

No, it's because they are fighting terrorism, and fighting people who are trying to kick them off their land. Judaism is about as bad as Islam in my eyes. If, if, they used chemical weapons then I condemn that, but that doesn't make it a terrorist state.

So now you are denying the use of chemical weapons? I don't know what to say to you more than I already have said. The use of chemical weapons should never be allowed, whether it's used against a peace loving, democratic nation or the most filthy of terrorist organizations.

The use of chemical weapons is just the start of reasons why Israel is a terrorist state or terrorist sponsoring state. What about the raid and killing of the Turkish ship in INTERNATIONAL waters? The countless killings of Palestinian women and children (and I'm not talking about the consequences of bombing)? The use of children as human shields? The direct bombing of hospitals, government buildings, power and water stations in Gaza? The list goes on.

By definition, Israel clearly falls under terrorist state. There is no excuse you can use to deny it unless you are stupid enough to deny Israel ever takes part in such actions listed above.

BladeGunner14 wrote:

Mustangt125 wrote:

It's just plain retarded and youre totally grasping for straws by saying the government of the United States, a country in which you are allowed to live, is a terrorist organization just the same as the terrorists who run the Palestinians.

Also, as you say it's tough to negotiate when the Israelis are building settlements in....now read this....is THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They can build wherever they want.

You know what makes it tough to negotiate and take the terrorist/Palestinians seriously? Continuously launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods and sending suicide bombers into highly populated areas such as markets. The Palestinians don't deserve their own country. That's right I said it.

They're building illegal settlements in the Gaza Strip, you idiot. That isn't their country. You've got to be the most ignorant member on this forum.

Quite the contrary, as Polska stated, you are an idiot and I am in fact one of the most intelligent posters on the forum. So jog on, son.

Ahly - America is not a perfect country and we have never been. We have made mistakes. But to compare us to the Palestinians in terms of terror causing is just insane.

Mustangt125 wrote:

BladeGunner14 wrote:

They're building illegal settlements in the Gaza Strip, you idiot. That isn't their country. You've got to be the most ignorant member on this forum.

Quite the contrary, as Polska stated, you are an idiot and I am in fact one of the most intelligent posters on the forum. So jog on, son.

Ahly - America is not a perfect country and we have never been. We have made mistakes. But to compare us to the Palestinians in terms of terror causing is just insane.

I don't think it's insane at all to compare the amount of terrorism and awful things the US have done in the past. I would even argue that the US has done far worse.

However, that's not the point of my argument. By definition, the US and Israel are terrorist states. The same can be said about Hammas. We shouldn't be arguing about who is more of a terrorist.