Official Arsenal FC Thread

Keyser Söze wrote:So these posts of yours are serious? How insecure can you get You won and yet you're still this defensive? Wow.  

I didn't reply the 1st two times because you did this same nonsense in the WC and suckered me and Scott in. That time at least van Gaal tried to play along, but this time he hasn't. So everything you're saying is pretty retarded so I assumed it's you trying to get a reaction. But if it's not, then I guess I gave you too much credit. I didn't expect you to be this deluded and desperate. However, I still think this is you just trying to get a reaction.

What comments from Van Gaal are you talking about?

I'm not trying to get a reaction in any negative sense, we had a gameplan which was obvious to me upon seeing the lineup and we stuck to it. Load the defence and play two DMs to make up for the shit defenders and hope for the best with quick wing backs and ADM up front. It was the same as what was played at the World Cup pretty much, extremely difficult to break down despite average defenders with a quick forward.

RR Stfu.

http://www.espnfc.com/arsenal/story/2161201/arsene-wenger-principles-holding-arsenal-back-says-shareholder-alisher-usmanov

Just sack him. He's been given many chances to change and adapt to the modern game.

Who's going to come in and do a better job? I can't imagine him ever being sacked. If Arsenal finish lower than fourth, he should leave on his own accord.

He will never retire of his own accord, if he was going to do that he'd have done it when Arsenal beat Hull in Extra Time last season. It amazes me that Arsenal gave him a new contract after that, if I were in Kroenke's shoes I either would have had a quiet word in his ear telling him to jump before he was pushed or just kept making derisory contract offers and claimed he had unrealistic demands.

John Nicholson absolutely nailed him on F365 today, I highly recommend his article. Along with Daniel Taylor and myself he was one of the only prominent football people who came out against Moyes from the very start.

http://www.football365.com/john-nicholson/9577616/John-Nicholson

What he's saying isn't new. Arsenal fans have been saying that for years.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:He will never retire of his own accord, if he was going to do that he'd have done it when Arsenal beat Hull in Extra Time last season.  It amazes me that Arsenal gave him a new contract after that, if I were in Kroenke's shoes I either would have had a quiet word in his ear telling him to jump before he was pushed or just kept making derisory contract offers and claimed he had unrealistic demands.

John Nicholson absolutely nailed him on F365 today, I highly recommend his article.  Along with Daniel Taylor and myself he was one of the only prominent football people who came out against Moyes from the very start.

http://www.football365.com/john-nicholson/9577616/John-Nicholson

Kroenke backs him 100%.

Keyser Söze wrote:What he's saying isn't new. Arsenal fans have been saying that for years.

I always get the impression with Arsenal that you have a massive segment of elitist "we're not that sort of football club" wankers in your support who think sticking by someone who can't hack is a virtue and makes them better than everyone else (ourselves and the Vermin have the same problem). There might be a few of you saying he should go but they're always seen as a bit of a lunatic fringe, maybe that's just a false perception on my part though.

Would you sack him if you were in a position to do it?

The Zlatan wrote:

ResurrectionRooney wrote:He will never retire of his own accord, if he was going to do that he'd have done it when Arsenal beat Hull in Extra Time last season.  It amazes me that Arsenal gave him a new contract after that, if I were in Kroenke's shoes I either would have had a quiet word in his ear telling him to jump before he was pushed or just kept making derisory contract offers and claimed he had unrealistic demands.

John Nicholson absolutely nailed him on F365 today, I highly recommend his article.  Along with Daniel Taylor and myself he was one of the only prominent football people who came out against Moyes from the very start.

http://www.football365.com/john-nicholson/9577616/John-Nicholson

Kroenke backs him 100%.

Yeah, obviously, he would hardly have given him a 3 year contract with a massive salary otherwise. Fucking stupid to do it though. I reckon you'd be better off if you'd let Wenger walk appointed a player manager and spent the spare £7.5m on a defensive midfielder.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:

Keyser Söze wrote:What he's saying isn't new. Arsenal fans have been saying that for years.

I always get the impression with Arsenal that you have a massive segment of elitist "we're not that sort of football club" wankers in your support who think sticking by someone who can't hack is a virtue and makes them better than everyone else (ourselves and the Vermin have the same problem).  There might be a few of you saying he should go but they're always seen as a bit of a lunatic fringe, maybe that's just a false perception on my part though.

Would you sack him if you were in a position to do it?

That is very true actually.

I'd let him see out the rest of the shambolic season and then ask him to leave at the end of it. If he refuses I would sack him.

I think that's the fairest option.

SBSP wrote:Who's going to come in and do a better job? I can't imagine him ever being sacked. If Arsenal finish lower than fourth, he should leave on his own accord.

Klopp

Keyser Söze wrote:

ResurrectionRooney wrote:


I always get the impression with Arsenal that you have a massive segment of elitist "we're not that sort of football club" wankers in your support who think sticking by someone who can't hack is a virtue and makes them better than everyone else (ourselves and the Vermin have the same problem).  There might be a few of you saying he should go but they're always seen as a bit of a lunatic fringe, maybe that's just a false perception on my part though.

Would you sack him if you were in a position to do it?

That is very true actually.

I'd let him see out the rest of the shambolic season and then ask him to leave at the end of it. If he refuses I would sack him.

Why wait?

Better the devil you know.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:

Keyser Söze wrote:

That is very true actually.

I'd let him see out the rest of the shambolic season and then ask him to leave at the end of it. If he refuses I would sack him.

Why wait?

No decent manager would come in now and even if they did it would be unfair to burden them with this shit of a season. So it would have to be someone on an interim basis till the end of the season, I don't think someone coming in like that would have much of an impact and even if they could the discontent from the fans at actually sacking Wenger mid way through a season would derail the season even further.

Losing 3-0 to Stoke and the worst thing is I'm not surprised at all

No point in even going there, it's so embarrassing watch.

Has Calum Chambers always been such a filthy player or is it something Arsenal have instilled into him?

Since he joined us he's always been shit.

Keyser Söze wrote:Since he joined us he's always been shit.

That's not really true at all. With the exception of the Montero humiliation, he's done a very good job at right back. He's got excellent technique and lots of raw potential. He just shouldn't be playing as much as he has, especially not in two different positions as part of a defence that seems to change every other week.

Agricultural football.

Ra's al Ghul wrote:

Keyser Söze wrote:Since he joined us he's always been shit.

That's not really true at all. With the exception of the Montero humiliation, he's done a very good job at right back. He's got excellent technique and lots of raw potential. He just shouldn't be playing as much as he has, especially not in two different positions as part of a defence that seems to change every other week.

This isn't revisionism from me because I've been saying it vocally from his very 1st game and even before that when we 1st signed him.

If by technique you mean his ability on the ball (in non pressurized situations) then I don't disagree, he's got a nice touch, good composure and given enough time and space he does well attacking wise in crossing and distributing the ball. However, his defensive frailties are so glaring I don't see any of his positives as redeeming enough (yet). What you view as raw potential I view as current inability. When he goes touch tight to a player that's in possession of the ball he's far too weak and naive, get's rolled, turned and beaten so easily and in doing so he either leaves so much space in behind or gives away a foul and a yellow card. If it's a leg race then it's no question he's going to get beaten because he's painfully slow. When he's under pressure he loses all his on the ball composure and simple puts the ball out of play time and time again (I think the Spurs game is an example of that). What few times he's played at CB he's been positionally oblivious, but that probably isn't helped by Mertesacker not guiding him at all. He had a few good moments in his early games and they certainly got blown out of proportion.

I'm all for blaming Wenger but the players have to take some blame as well and I think that Monreal, Chambers and Mertesacker (Gibbs has been distinctly average) have been inherently bad this season.

There were no games where he was put under higher pressure than the Dortmund and Southampton ones, and he was excellent in both. Can't really remember to what you're referring with regards to the Spurs game but I'm quite sure he played well in that game as well. Most issues you have with him would be eradicated if he received sufficient protection and was part of a more stable back four.

Basically, you don't go from having an extremely stable back four and one of the highest number of clean sheets to 18 goals in 15 matches in a year unless it's a managerial issue. Players are playing badly because they're being mismanaged, simple as that. I really take issue with identifying individual players who are clearly being horribly misutilized (Chambers, Monreal, Ozil) as the source of our problems. People keep pointing to Sanchez and wondering why everyone else can't play at his level and it makes no sense to me. Sanchez is merely an exception. He's so forceful in his style that no matter what you do with him you're not going to be able to hinder his abilities. Other players aren't like that. They're specialized for a reason and they constantly have to deal with this idiot throwing central players on the wings and wide players in the centre. Almost every problem we currently have is down to his ineptitude.

I don't mean games against high pressing/pressure teams, I meant more in terms of examples during games when Chambers it pressed high up the pitch. Instead of playing the ball up field, beating his man or passing to a teammate he simply kicks out for a throw in or corner without any thought. Obviously that will improve with time. I don't expect a 19 year old with a handful of senior appearances in his 1st season at such a big club to not have problems like these so I do think he has an excuse (and a justified one), but I'm not going to pretend like it's not a problem, because it is. He playing well in respect of teenage defenders but he's not at the level you need to be at to be a PL defender. That'll probably come with time but again I'm not going to say he's playing well just because he's 19 and inexperienced, he has mitigating circumstances but it doesn't mean he's been good.

Sorry it wasn't the Spurs game. Had to check through my posts on EA and it turns out it was the Everton game that caught my eye in terms of how often he kicked it out needlessly.

I'm not a fan of Arsene Wenger and I'm very much in the Wenger out camp, but it seems to me that sometimes fans exaggerate the situation and make it appear that if he went we'd improve with this current squad. I don't think that's true at all. Of course he has to take all the blame for purchasing such awful players, but they are just that, awful players (or players that have become awful).

I don't know if you think me or other Arsenal fans criticisms of Monreal have been a recent thing but it hasn't. He wasn't great when he 1st joined us but I brushed that off as him needing time to settle. However, last season he was pretty bad whenever he played, he cost us numerous times. I'll concede that some of his shortcomings recently have been because he's been played out of position but other mistakes he's made haven't had anything to do with not being a CB, and bar his 1st few games this season he's been bad at LB as well (most recently the Southampton game).

I've criticised Ozil to death so I'm not going to go into too much detail with him. I will say that even taking into account him being played out of position he is still God awful. Some level of defensive duties should not be beyond anyone. I'm not expecting him to defend box to box, but when you're a few cm away from an opponent and he just runs off you it's disgraceful. And I know you've agree with me in the past about his inability to take responsibility in attacking areas, playing on the left or not he shouldn't be content with play a 1 yard side ways pass and then just stand there.  

He has been given a fair shot in the middle and whilst he has marginally improved it still wasn't to an acceptable level. I personally don't think the systems of Bremen, Madrid and Germany are that dissimilar to ours and yet he hasn't played anywhere near the heights he reached with them. And I don't expect him to. I'm not asking for him to be the master assister he was at Madrid but he has to at least play at a decent standard. More often than not he's our worst (along with Giroud) player whenever he plays. Playing on the left or not having runners or whatever the reason shouldn't hinder your ability to perform basic actions like running, dribbling and passing. And he's started playing like this for Germany. He's just disinterested (and has been since he joined us) and I know I mock all that passion and spirit nonsense but when you no longer care (and you can visibly see it) then you are going to play dreadful.

Sanchez's abilities were hindered at Barca. I know it's because of Messi but still. And he's a similar player to Suarez so Wenger was clearly able to identify what type of player would do well at us (no matter how obvious it was).

Again, I very much want Wenger to leave and he's no doubt a massive factor in our poor form but I don't accept that reasoning about the back 4. A manager that knows the benefits of having a settled system for your back 4 (as shown by the one he inherited from Graham and the Invincibles one) isn't going change up after the season we had. For years we've been criticised because of our back 4 so I don't believe that after finally getting it right last season that he'd just throw it out the window this season. He is inept and he is out of touch with the game but a manager as educated as him and one that's been in the game for as long as him would not do that. In fact even a Sunday league manager wouldn't do that. You'd have to be insane or a thick shit to do that. Also, I've never seen him criticise the defence as often as he as this season, and for a manager that is know to be ultra defensive about his players that's saying something. So for weeks he's been publicly criticising the back 4 yet it's never once crossed his mind to revert back to last seasons successful methods? It's just incomprehensible.

He is the probably the biggest factor in our downfall and I'll rightfully criticise him, but by the same token the players have also been individually  poor and they deserve some as well.

(sorry for the wall of text )

Might be stating the obvious here but Sanchez is an absolute superstar.  Barcelona are idiotic to sell him and buy a criminal maniac.

Bellerin and in particular Debuchy were very good today.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Might be stating the obvious here but Sanchez is an absolute superstar.  Barcelona are idiotic to sell him and buy a criminal maniac.

Vela is better

Keyser Söze wrote:Bellerin and in particular Debuchy were very good today.

Agreed. Very surprised at how well Debuchy did, hopefully Bellerin will get so good that Barcelona will pay us £25 million in a few seasons to get him back.

Finally get to watch Match of the Day tonight too.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Might be stating the obvious here but Sanchez is an absolute superstar.  Barcelona are idiotic to sell him and buy a criminal maniac.

Barcelona aren't really missing him.

Yeah, Barcelona's problems are in midfield, not in attack. Xavi and Iniesta are shadows of their former selves, and Rakitic has been underwhelming recently.