Liverpool FC Official Thread

kyro7 wrote:

Scott wrote:Man United - 12

That was going well before we let in 6 v City.

Cadbury wrote:

Mr Leiva wrote:

Just a shame, he is so isolated half of the time.

We need a Owen type of player.

Suarez and Kuyt lack the positional discipline to support him, Henderson just can't... Maxi probably could. He seemed to link up with Torres well last season.

In all honesty, I can't see Suarez and Carroll developing a lethal partnership. It's no coincidence that Suarez has linked up well with Bellamy and Kuyt and not Carroll. I'd probably drop Carroll for Chelsea, it's harsh on him but it has to be done.

An Owen type player would be good. Just a quick thinking striker with good technique and an eye for goal. Bent might have worked.

Also, the term DM is a misnomer. Midfielders aren't purely defensive, they're there, along with their partners, to do a job, which is to deny easy possession to the opposition while facilitating it for their own team. What I called energy and glue. How it's done depends on the personnel, but it typically involves one holding position in front of the defence and one roaming ahead. This isn't fixed, but the point is, it has to be done between them. With the Alonso/Mascherano midfield, Alonso usually sat while Mascherano roamed. When Alonso was up for set pieces, Mascherano swept the vacated area behind him. That's what Mascherano does, and he's incomparable at it, and that's why he's found a niche for himself in La Liga at CB.

Now how does this relate to Lucas/Adam? Well, Lucas has shown he can do the holding role extremely well, to the point of being criticised for being limited to that (while Brazilians think of him in a completely different way, as a technical volante rather than the physical ones they've had in the last couple of decades). We know he can do it. Can Adam do it? It doesn't look like he can, at least to a satisfactory level. Which means, for the good of the team, Lucas has to stay in that position, otherwise there would be no competition in the midfield before the ball reaches the defence. All the criticism of Lucas for not going forward ignore this. If he goes forward, it leaves no real cover in midfield. All the theory of pass and move football isn't just dependent on players moving into space, it's also dependent on other players filling in behind them. Both aspects of off the ball movement are equally important. But one part has a measurable end product (goals, shots on goal), while the other part doesn't, so the part that doesn't get a stat is ignored.

Mr Leiva wrote:

Jordan Lussey signed pro.

Dean wrote:Totally agree with Scott here, some of the points you're making are pathetic Jordan and as Scott said, it's selective memory at its best. Missing chances is down to Kenny's tactics? What? Come off whatever you're smokin', because that is bullshit.

And yeah, you do make some good points about us not being as well organised as we were under Rafa, accept that, but you know what, football is about finding a balance and it can be very hard to find that balance, Rafa struggled with it for 6 years. I can never ever remember us creating this many opportunities under Rafa, never. Is Kenny as good as Rafa in the tactical department? No, he's not. However is Kenny tactically naive? No fucking chance. I do actually believe Kenny's quite underrated as a tactician, for the fact of that everyone goes on about him being a great man-manager, it seems to be one or the other, why can't he be good at both? He's made some great decisions tactically since he's been back.

And even ex-players who have worked under Kenny have came out and said how good he was as manager and not just a 'man-manager'. The man won us 4 league titles as manager of the club for fucks sake, sorry but you don't win titles by just being a good man-manager. Also Steve Clarke and Kevin Keen deal with the tactical side too.

We're not as structured and organised under Kenny, accept that, but we're much much better with the ball and we're creating lots more chances than we ever were under Rafa, so you know, there's pro's and con's of different managers. Rafa never gave enough of the players a chance to express themselves with his structured like tactics, Kenny maybe gives the players a little too much freedom to express themselves, because that's what he loves, he loves for players to express themselves.

thedinho wrote:I have a theory Daglish brought British as a way to experiment how you would do in the league if you bought players in a similar fashion to how you bought them in the 80s. So now he's realised the experiment has failed he'll go out and buy a load Latin speaking pretty boys so we'll play liquid football.

Just watching the game back again, and already a minute in, and already we have an example of the kind of indecision and lack of understanding that has been plaguing us this season imo.

Enrique picks up a loose balls down the left, bursts pasts the Swansea player...

At that stage, you'd expect Luis and Suarez to b bursting a gut to get into the box(Downing is stood 25 yards back looking at Enrique's arse)

But forward it on two seconds later and....

The result is a high looping ball to the back post in the hope of picking out Henderson. For most teams that's a great opening, for us not so much.

Jay wrote:Someone saying we were slow to get out because Carra wasn't playing? He's the worst culprit of it, half the time he stands next to Reina telling him where to kick/throw it when he should be pushing 20 yards further up the pitch.

SpiritOfShankly wrote:

Jay wrote:Someone saying we were slow to get out because Carra wasn't playing? He's the worst culprit of it, half the time he stands next to Reina telling him where to kick/throw it when he should be pushing 20 yards further up the pitch.

No not slow because he wasnt playing no body knew what they were doing Saturday it was unbelievable. Skrtel's got an empty head and Agger just doesn't lead the line. The whole back line lacked leadership.

thedinho wrote:We always need someone else

Mr Leiva wrote:

SpiritOfShankly wrote:


No not slow because he wasnt playing no body knew what they were doing Saturday it was unbelievable. Skrtel's got an empty head and Agger just doesn't lead the line. The whole back line lacked leadership.

Last two games = two clean sheets.

Agger is natural born leader. He reminds me of Hyypia. So composed, and that helps the defence.

Didn't you notice, for the first time in many games, Skrtel or Agger are not getting shouted out and they were playing with smiles on there faces. They both looked in control, in both games.

When you are at the game, you hear Agger and Skrtel communicating with the rest of the squad. On TV, you only hear Carra screaming his head off, half of the time moaning at someone because he fucked up or Reina, shouting REINA's.

Mr Leiva wrote:

Mr Leiva wrote:Happened a lot this season. No one in the fucking box. The balance in the team, is wrong. No one attacking the box.

thedinho wrote:I have a theory Daglish brought British as a way to experiment how you would do in the league if you bought players in a similar fashion to how you bought them in the 80s. So now he's realised the experiment has failed he'll go out and buy a load Latin speaking pretty boys so we'll play liquid football.

El_indian wrote:he's talking about the possession at the back, in one instance Reina received a back pass, mis-controlled and almost lost it..

The possession at the back doesn't annoy me, I like it, I've seen considerably less hoofing and less long balls from Reina, choosing rather to build from the back.

El_indian wrote:I encourage it

Chip wrote:if Lucas ever gets injured we should play Agger in midfield