Best player of all time

It's my new meme.

Shut up Jamie.

Pele and Zidane have too many votes.

kyro7 wrote:Pele and Zidane have too many votes.

You have too many posts

Chris wrote:It's my new meme.

Shut up Jamie.

Didn't read lol.












Edit: Keyboard seems to be fixed

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Do you think if Henry was as good as Messi Wenger wouldn't have had him in a role where he could create just as many goals and scored even more? It's not as though Barca's other strikers go without goals because they're reliant on Messi either, or he always gets the ball, Pedro and Villa both scored more goals on their own last season than Henry's main partner (Dennis Bergkamp) ever did in a season. I'd say Arsenal were at least as reliant on Henry as Barca are on Messi, Messi is just a much better player so he can do more.

Henry was in the best role he could be in to influence play. You aren't going to place a striker all over the field and expect the more from him than Henry provided. Messi does always end up with the ball so I can't see how you can even make that dumbass statement. Villa didn't suffer because he basically just filled in where Eto'o would have typically been. Once Samuel left Messi's goal totals increased gradually, but his possession of the ball has basically been the same since he became the centerpiece. I don't know what you are even bringing Bergkamp into the discussion because in his ENTIRE career he was never a prolific goal scorer so bringing him up weakens your argument. Arsenal were only ever 100% reliant on Henry during the 7th season which ultimately lead to why he left after the 8th season. Barcelona are far more reliant on Messi and if he ever were to go down to an injury they wouldn't be nearly as dangerous even with Iniesta, Xavi, etc in the team.

Also, I think you are being too simplistic when it comes to player roles, saying he is a STRIKER so we should only judge him on goals, or he is a midfielder so his goals don't matter, that's just bollocks. Messi's role in the Barcelona team is to score goals, the same as Henry's was at Arsenal, and Messi does it much better than what Henry did.

I'm not being simplistic nor am I implying or using Henry being a striker as a reason to not compare them. Again you're bringing up shit that isn't even part of the discussion. I am simply pointing out that Messi HAS to score as many goals as he does because Barcelona rely on him to do so. Messi is the ONLY midfielder in the world that scores as many goals as he does and moving him to the central spot didn't really impact that since he is all over the offensive end of the pitch anyway. At Arsenal Henry played as a lone striker a lot and with a partner, but still stuck to the box area as strikers do so his impact on the game wasn't felt as much as Messi's due to Messi being a midfielder which covers more area. That much is fact. Just look at heat maps during matches.

The League was certainly better. When Henry was at it's peak, the League had one Champions League Semi Finalist if it was lucky, when Ronaldo scored 31 goals (In a 4-4-2 with two strikers mind) there were regularly 3 teams in the Champions League Semi Finals, England's coefficient was rapidly climbing to the top of Europe, and the Champions League Final was an all English affair. In that Champions League Final he actually scored a goal rather than bottling several easy chances like one player I could name. He hardly ever played as a striker for United in that season, his role had more defensive responsibilities than what Henry's did, certainly, the numbers speak for themselves on that (4-4-2 Vs. 4-3-3), and this season he has mainly played on the wing and has still broken record for goalscoring that Henry never approached.

I'm sorry but you're a fucking moron. The PL has been in decline since Henry left England. Bringing up the CL or Europe is completely irrelevant because we are talking about LEAGUE PLAY and nothing more. My entire discussion has focused on just EPL games so stop trying to include other shit that has nothing to do with what I am point out. FACT is that Cristiano had ONE 20 goal season compared to Henry doing it 62.5% of his time in England. Also even in United 4-4-2 during his 31 goal season he was operating as a forward and not a winger so you could basically say he was playing striker. He had more shots on goal than anyone on United and spent as much time in the box as United's out and out strikers. Turn off your Manchester United & Cristiano Ronaldo blinders for one second and look at the facts, they don't lie. Whether you want to use statistics or match play the results of who was a better scorer stand. Collectively Henry faced much better team by team defenses than Cristiano did in his United career. Saying he played in a better PL is fucking bullshit and completely false because teams were better during HEnry's time at Arsenal and have gotten worse as the league has basically become more and more dominated by the same 4 or 5 teams.

Sounds like sour grapes to me. When there are two independent awards and your boy doesn't win either of them maybe it's time to re-evaluate your boy.

Nope, no sour grapes, just a broken voting system. Two independent awards that each have fucked up voting systems has nothign to do with needing to re-evaluate by dude. The Ballon D'Or has always had a shading process of chosing the winner and the Fifa World Player of the Year has ALWAYS been a joke when it comes to voting.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:See above. The Premier League was an international joke when Henry was dominating it, it was a fucking behemoth when Ronaldo was.

See above statements where I am calling bullshit on your dumb statement. If it was a fucking behemoth then why could Cristiano Ronaldo only manage 1 20+ goal season?

People are underrating Henry way to much. Henry is one of the finest strikers in world football, people saying defenses where weak in EPL when Henry played? Well when Arsenal where in Europe... (This is for you Mauro who thinks Henry wouldn't be as effective in Italy) in 03/04 Henry played against Inter and scored two goals and assisted 2 more in the San Siro. Then next season against Bayern, he scored again. Then in 05/06...scored against Juventus (Who had arguably the best defense in the world) And one more against Real Madrid.

Henry also had a great game against Italy in euro 2000.


Henry is a fucking amazing striker, yes, he's up there with the great Ronaldo and is one of the best strikers to play football.

How many goals has Henry scored in Cup Finals?

chiboygeorge wrote:People are underrating Henry way to much. Henry is one of the finest strikers in world football, people saying defenses where weak in EPL when Henry played? Well when Arsenal where in Europe... (This is for you Mauro who thinks Henry wouldn't be as effective in Italy) in 03/04 Henry played against Inter and scored two goals and assisted 2 more in the San Siro. Then next season against Bayern, he scored again. Then in 05/06...scored against Juventus (Who had arguably the best defense in the world) And one more against Real Madrid.

Henry also had a great game against Italy in euro 2000.


Henry is a fucking amazing striker, yes, he's up there with the great Ronaldo and is one of the best strikers to play football.

No one is underrating him. Saying he is not as good as Cristiano Ronaldo is not an insult at all.

grenade187 wrote:

kyro7 wrote:Pele and Zidane have too many votes.

You have too many posts

Both statements are correct, thank you for proving my point.


Henry was unbelievable.

Btw, Henry > Zidane and Pele.

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:People are underrating Henry way to much. Henry is one of the finest strikers in world football, people saying defenses where weak in EPL when Henry played? Well when Arsenal where in Europe... (This is for you Mauro who thinks Henry wouldn't be as effective in Italy) in 03/04 Henry played against Inter and scored two goals and assisted 2 more in the San Siro. Then next season against Bayern, he scored again. Then in 05/06...scored against Juventus (Who had arguably the best defense in the world) And one more against Real Madrid.

Henry also had a great game against Italy in euro 2000.


Henry is a fucking amazing striker, yes, he's up there with the great Ronaldo and is one of the best strikers to play football.

No one is underrating him. Saying he is not as good as Cristiano Ronaldo is not an insult at all.

Why is he not as good as C.R.?

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:People are underrating Henry way to much. Henry is one of the finest strikers in world football, people saying defenses where weak in EPL when Henry played? Well when Arsenal where in Europe... (This is for you Mauro who thinks Henry wouldn't be as effective in Italy) in 03/04 Henry played against Inter and scored two goals and assisted 2 more in the San Siro. Then next season against Bayern, he scored again. Then in 05/06...scored against Juventus (Who had arguably the best defense in the world) And one more against Real Madrid.

Henry also had a great game against Italy in euro 2000.


Henry is a fucking amazing striker, yes, he's up there with the great Ronaldo and is one of the best strikers to play football.

No one is underrating him. Saying he is not as good as Cristiano Ronaldo is not an insult at all.

Why is he not as good as C.R.?

Well, he's had 2 stand out seasons(2007/2008 and last season) better than any individual season of Henry. It's personal opinion more than anything, I think both were/are sensational footballers but Cristiano Ronaldo will go down as a better player in history I'm sure.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:How many goals has Henry scored in Cup Finals?

What relevance does that have in this discussion? You keep bringing up shit that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

How many World Cups or Euro Championships does Cristiano Ronaldo have since you want to bring up pointless shit.

Fine Shagger wrote:Well, he's had 2 stand out seasons(2007/2008 and last season) better than any individual season of Henry. It's personal opinion more than anything, I think both were/are sensational footballers but Cristiano Ronaldo will go down as a better player in history I'm sure.

Right it is personal opinion, but some of you are making it seem like Cristiano Ronaldo just blows him out of the water when its quite the opposite. He may have had 2 breakout seasons yet from 2001 to 2006 there was not a better striker on the planet than Henry. As I said before, Henry shits on Cristiano Ronaldo quite easily.

AriseForLife wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:Well, he's had 2 stand out seasons(2007/2008 and last season) better than any individual season of Henry. It's personal opinion more than anything, I think both were/are sensational footballers but Cristiano Ronaldo will go down as a better player in history I'm sure.

Right it is personal opinion, but some of you are making it seem like Cristiano Ronaldo just blows him out of the water when its quite the opposite. He may have had 2 breakout seasons yet from 2001 to 2006 there was not a better striker on the planet than Henry. As I said before, Henry shits on Cristiano Ronaldo quite easily.

I agree but disagree with no one was better. Ronaldo and Shevchencko I believe were better from 01-06 than Henry.

AriseForLife wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:Well, he's had 2 stand out seasons(2007/2008 and last season) better than any individual season of Henry. It's personal opinion more than anything, I think both were/are sensational footballers but Cristiano Ronaldo will go down as a better player in history I'm sure.

Right it is personal opinion, but some of you are making it seem like Cristiano Ronaldo just blows him out of the water when its quite the opposite. He may have had 2 breakout seasons yet from 2001 to 2006 there was not a better striker on the planet than Henry. As I said before, Henry shits on Cristiano Ronaldo quite easily.

What a bunch of hypocritical shit. Criticising for making the difference seem greater than it is then doing the exact same thing

I don't want to put Ronaldo down as a player, he's the best winger I've ever seen and now is up there as a striker.

Best players I've ever seen are Henry, both Ronaldo's and Messi. There is not alot between them at all and who is the best is purely down to personal preference IMO.

If you say Luiz Ronaldo and somebody else says Messi neither opinion should be laughed at. Both could be just as fantastic as the other on a game to game basis and that goes for all 4.

chiboygeorge wrote:I agree but disagree with no one was better. Ronaldo and Shevchencko I believe were better from 01-06 than Henry.

Neither of them scored more goals during the same period.

Henry: 166 goals
Ronaldo: 107 goals
Shevchenko: 110 goals

It's not even a contest. That doesn't even count the 4 double digit seasons he had 10+ assists.

Fine Shagger wrote:What a bunch of hypocritical shit. Criticising for making the difference seem greater than it is then doing the exact same thing

Not hypocritical when there are facts to back up the claim. Opinion is fine when saying one or the other is better, but the stats speak for themselves when looking at their PL performances.

What stats are these?

Fine Shagger wrote:What stats are these?

Just go back through the discussion and read.

AriseForLife wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:I agree but disagree with no one was better. Ronaldo and Shevchencko I believe were better from 01-06 than Henry.

Neither of them scored more goals during the same period.

Henry: 166 goals
Ronaldo: 107 goals
Shevchenko: 110 goals

It's not even a contest. That doesn't even count the 4 double digit seasons he had 10+ assists.

It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

They are all very...let's say, hand picked to suit your argument.

I mean on the one hand you say Henry is better than C.Ronaldo because of his goal record(I think this is the reason anyway), and yet if you compare Messi to Henry using a goal record apparently that's not allowed?

chiboygeorge wrote:

AriseForLife wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:I agree but disagree with no one was better. Ronaldo and Shevchencko I believe were better from 01-06 than Henry.

Neither of them scored more goals during the same period.

Henry: 166 goals
Ronaldo: 107 goals
Shevchenko: 110 goals

It's not even a contest. That doesn't even count the 4 double digit seasons he had 10+ assists.

It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

Its all personal opinion tbh. Personally I think Henry was the better player (ability wise) but I can respect someone's opinion if they think Ronaldo was better as they were both QUALITY footballers.

grenade187 wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

AriseForLife wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:I agree but disagree with no one was better. Ronaldo and Shevchencko I believe were better from 01-06 than Henry.

Neither of them scored more goals during the same period.

Henry: 166 goals
Ronaldo: 107 goals
Shevchenko: 110 goals

It's not even a contest. That doesn't even count the 4 double digit seasons he had 10+ assists.

It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

Its all personal opinion tbh. Personally I think Henry was the better player (ability wise) but I can respect someone's opinion if they think Ronaldo was better as they were both QUALITY footballers.

He's talking about Brazilian Ronaldo there.

You know that right? Because while I admit Cristiano and Henry are debatable, it's not even close to being a contest between THE Ronaldo and Henry.

chiboygeorge wrote:It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

If's don't matter, he got injuries and it is what it is. Ronaldo is a legend without a doubt, but from the time that Henry was converted from winger to striker, no striker on the planet scored more goals. I am not saying that Henry is better than Ronaldo or Ronaldo is better than Henry, I am simply saying that during that period (when all three players where healthy and playing regularly, Henry out performed them all).

Fine Shagger wrote:They are all very...let's say, hand picked to suit your argument.

I mean on the one hand you say Henry is better than C.Ronaldo because of his goal record(I think this is the reason anyway), and yet if you compare Messi to Henry using a goal record apparently that's not allowed?

It's not handpicked at all. As for Messi I have already acknowledged that Messi is a superior player, that much cannot be debated. My words about Messi were only use to point out that his statistics don't shock me when you consider how much possession he has.

I am saying that Henry is better than Cristiano period, not just because of goal record. Is Cristiano a better player now? Yes, he is coming into his prime where as Henry is at the end of his. In his Prime though Henry easily eclipses Cristiano in my opinion at this point. There are still many seasons left for Cristiano to change my opinion, but when it comes to the PL its not even a contest of who was better in the PL.

AriseForLife wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

If's don't matter, he got injuries and it is what it is. Ronaldo is a legend without a doubt, but from the time that Henry was converted from winger to striker, no striker on the planet scored more goals. I am not saying that Henry is better than Ronaldo or Ronaldo is better than Henry, I am simply saying that during that period (when all three players where healthy and playing regularly, Henry out performed them all).

Fine Shagger wrote:They are all very...let's say, hand picked to suit your argument.

I mean on the one hand you say Henry is better than C.Ronaldo because of his goal record(I think this is the reason anyway), and yet if you compare Messi to Henry using a goal record apparently that's not allowed?

It's not handpicked at all. As for Messi I have already acknowledged that Messi is a superior player, that much cannot be debated. My words about Messi were only use to point out that his statistics don't shock me when you consider how much possession he has.

I am saying that Henry is better than Cristiano period, not just because of goal record. Is Cristiano a better player now? Yes, he is coming into his prime where as Henry is at the end of his. In his Prime though Henry easily eclipses Cristiano in my opinion at this point. There are still many seasons left for Cristiano to change my opinion, but when it comes to the PL its not even a contest of who was better in the PL.

Again though I ask, what are these stats that prove my statement wrong that the best player ability wise the premiership has seen is C.Ronaldo and not Henry.

If you were to use stats they would say that at best ability C.Ronaldo > Henry in the premiership so I'm curious what you have up your sleeve that contradicts this.

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

AriseForLife wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:I agree but disagree with no one was better. Ronaldo and Shevchencko I believe were better from 01-06 than Henry.

Neither of them scored more goals during the same period.

Henry: 166 goals
Ronaldo: 107 goals
Shevchenko: 110 goals

It's not even a contest. That doesn't even count the 4 double digit seasons he had 10+ assists.

It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

Its all personal opinion tbh. Personally I think Henry was the better player (ability wise) but I can respect someone's opinion if they think Ronaldo was better as they were both QUALITY footballers.

He's talking about Brazilian Ronaldo there.

You know that right? Because while I admit Cristiano and Henry are debatable, it's not even close to being a contest between THE Ronaldo and Henry.

Off coarse I know that. How is it not a contest ? Its been widely discussed by many football critics and fans for years now each with their own opinion on who was the superior footballer.

Fine Shagger wrote:Again though I ask, what are these stats that prove my statement wrong that the best player ability wise the premiership has seen is C.Ronaldo and not Henry.

If you were to use stats they would say that at best ability C.Ronaldo > Henry in the premiership so I'm curious what you have up your sleeve that contradicts this.

Henry's PL statistics EASILY dwarf Cristiano's. His last three seasons at Manchester United were his best and they only include ONE season in which he scored more than 18 league goals. Hell even if you include his Champion's League, cups, etc he still has NOTHING on Henry. Looking at the last three seasons he played in Manchester (aside from the 42 goal season) his goal tally in all comps 2006/7 & 2008/9 is still less than some seasons only counting Henry's PL goals. Henry has more goals and more assists while playing as a striker which strikers don't typically get boat loads of assists. I don't see how you can sit here and try to argue he was a better player in the PL when statistics say otherwise.

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

AriseForLife wrote:

Neither of them scored more goals during the same period.

Henry: 166 goals
Ronaldo: 107 goals
Shevchenko: 110 goals

It's not even a contest. That doesn't even count the 4 double digit seasons he had 10+ assists.

It is a contest what you talking about? that time period you put favor Henry very much but overall career Ronaldo is known as the more superior forward to Henry. It's not just the goalscoring, but trophies, awards, and pure footballing ability. I believe if Ronaldo never got injuries...his goalscoring record would have been untouchable.

Its all personal opinion tbh. Personally I think Henry was the better player (ability wise) but I can respect someone's opinion if they think Ronaldo was better as they were both QUALITY footballers.

He's talking about Brazilian Ronaldo there.

You know that right? Because while I admit Cristiano and Henry are debatable, it's not even close to being a contest between THE Ronaldo and Henry.

Off coarse I know that. How is it not a contest ? Its been widely discussed by many football critics and fans for years now each with their own opinion on who was the superior footballer.

It's not a contest because Ronaldo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> every striker in your lifetime. Not even 0.0000000000000000000000000000001% doubt about it. Anyone who disagrees can't be trusted to rate any player.

AriseForLife wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:Again though I ask, what are these stats that prove my statement wrong that the best player ability wise the premiership has seen is C.Ronaldo and not Henry.

If you were to use stats they would say that at best ability C.Ronaldo > Henry in the premiership so I'm curious what you have up your sleeve that contradicts this.

Henry's PL statistics EASILY dwarf Cristiano's. His last three seasons at Manchester United were his best and they only include ONE season in which he scored more than 18 league goals. Hell even if you include his Champion's League, cups, etc he still has NOTHING on Henry. Henry has more goals and more assists while playing as a striker which strikers don't typically get boat loads of assists.

I said at best ability you clown, stop hand picking stats. There are no stats to show the best ability of a player.

Although the closest option would be to use the single best season, in which case Cristiano > Henry.

P.S You say Messi is a midfielder so goals shouldn't be included when judging him. Henry is a striker so don't use assists to judge him going by the same (admittedly retarded) logic.