Best player of all time

chiboygeorge wrote:

Roloman4 wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Roloman4 wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:
Not top 2 best but one of the bests..

What's your list of top ten strikers on history?

Rolo why?

Só quero saber.

Puta

1. Pele
2. Ronaldo
3. Van Basten
4. Di Stefano
5. Muller
6. Baggio
7. Puskas
8. Henry
9. Rivaldo
10. Romario

Obvious bias.

No Eusébio

Ricardo wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Roloman4 wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Roloman4 wrote:

What's your list of top ten strikers on history?

Rolo why?

Só quero saber.

Puta

1. Pele
2. Ronaldo
3. Van Basten
4. Di Stefano
5. Muller
6. Baggio
7. Puskas
8. Henry
9. Rivaldo
10. Romario

Obvious bias.

No Eusébio

in top 20's he can be there.

Baggio and Rivaldo weren't strikers.

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:Fuck this. If you think there isn't much between Zidane and Messi at club level I'm not even going to discuss it. Get your eyes/head/whatever checked out ASAP. The statistics say it all in this case.

Statistics say Pele>Messi

Those statistics aren't comparable. Messi and Zidane played in the same continent, the same league and the same European competition.

No offense but judging by what you have said you don't know much about Zidane or his days at Juve so your opinion seems very biased.
You should not use statistics as a way to prove a player is better especially if they had different roles and positions that's the point

Where have I used statistics to prove it?

I said the statistics in this case are right.

I know a fuck load about Zidane, if you haven't noticed I am and always will be on a crusade to debunk the whole myth that Zidane is among Ronaldo, Messi, Maradona, Pele, Cruyff etc etc etc as the best of all time.

Whoever was the greatest Zidane was a Footballing god.

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:Fuck this. If you think there isn't much between Zidane and Messi at club level I'm not even going to discuss it. Get your eyes/head/whatever checked out ASAP. The statistics say it all in this case.

Statistics say Pele>Messi

Those statistics aren't comparable. Messi and Zidane played in the same continent, the same league and the same European competition.

No offense but judging by what you have said you don't know much about Zidane or his days at Juve so your opinion seems very biased.
You should not use statistics as a way to prove a player is better especially if they had different roles and positions that's the point

Where have I used statistics to prove it?

I said the statistics in this case are right.

I know a fuck load about Zidane, if you haven't noticed I am and always will be on a crusade to debunk the whole myth that Zidane is among Ronaldo, Messi, Maradona, Pele, Cruyff etc etc etc as the best of all time.

If you knew Zidane you would also know that he was a beast in club level and that he could have easily got same CL medal like Messi.

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

Statistics say Pele>Messi

Those statistics aren't comparable. Messi and Zidane played in the same continent, the same league and the same European competition.

No offense but judging by what you have said you don't know much about Zidane or his days at Juve so your opinion seems very biased.
You should not use statistics as a way to prove a player is better especially if they had different roles and positions that's the point

Where have I used statistics to prove it?

I said the statistics in this case are right.

I know a fuck load about Zidane, if you haven't noticed I am and always will be on a crusade to debunk the whole myth that Zidane is among Ronaldo, Messi, Maradona, Pele, Cruyff etc etc etc as the best of all time.

If you knew Zidane you would also know that he was a beast in club level and that he could have easily got same CL medal like Messi.

I know that talent wise Zidane is up there with the best. What prevents him is his season long consistency like I've said about 100000 times now. Big games he had nailed, small games week in week out he most certainly did not.

Roloman4 wrote:Baggio and Rivaldo weren't strikers.

Just because they are support strikers don't mean they aren't strikers.

chiboygeorge wrote:

Roloman4 wrote:Baggio and Rivaldo weren't strikers.

Just because they are support strikers don't mean they aren't strikers.

With the question I meant striker strikers, not support strikers, the others are fair game though.

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

grenade187 wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

Those statistics aren't comparable. Messi and Zidane played in the same continent, the same league and the same European competition.

No offense but judging by what you have said you don't know much about Zidane or his days at Juve so your opinion seems very biased.
You should not use statistics as a way to prove a player is better especially if they had different roles and positions that's the point

Where have I used statistics to prove it?

I said the statistics in this case are right.

I know a fuck load about Zidane, if you haven't noticed I am and always will be on a crusade to debunk the whole myth that Zidane is among Ronaldo, Messi, Maradona, Pele, Cruyff etc etc etc as the best of all time.

If you knew Zidane you would also know that he was a beast in club level and that he could have easily got same CL medal like Messi.

I know that talent wise Zidane is up there with the best. What prevents him is his season long consistency like I've said about 100000 times now. Big games he had nailed, small games week in week out he most certainly did not.

So he had to nail small games week in and week out to be considered the best? If he can do it in big games what in the fucking world makes you think he can't in lesser games? once again..in Juve Zidane was the best player on the planet. Controlled Serie A easily and was awared best player 2x

Fine Shagger wrote:

BMxJoga wrote:Zidane won a World Cup, Champions League, La Liga, Serie A and Euro. Messi has a ways to go.

Messi has won 5 League campaigns to Zidane's 3. He's won 3 Champions Leagues to Zidane's 1.

Step it up Zinedine.

Zidane's World Cup to none for Messi. Zidane has a Euro while Messi can't even capture a Copa America.Step it up Messi.

To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

Messi has won the Olympics though.

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

You talking about Zidane? done fuck all? oh my god.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Messi has won the Olympics though.

Rephrased to - Riquelme won olympics, would be easily won by Argentina without Messi but not won without Riquelme.

ResurrectionRooney wrote:Messi has won the Olympics though.

Wow U23 tournament.

chiboygeorge wrote:

Roloman4 wrote:Baggio and Rivaldo weren't strikers.

Just because they are support strikers don't mean they aren't strikers.

Strikers aren't attackers.

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

You talking about Zidane? done fuck all? oh my god.

In a lot of league games yes. Obviously doing fuck all is hyperbole but he was very far from his best. You see someone like Zidane stepping up their game in World cups or later stages of competitions as a good thing, I see it as a shame that he couldn't be arsed playing to his maximum every week.

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

EDIT: Wrongly worded never mind.

BMxJoga wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

Hmm, performances by who might you say?

What?

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

You talking about Zidane? done fuck all? oh my god.

In a lot of league games yes. Obviously doing fuck all is hyperbole but he was very far from his best. You see someone like Zidane stepping up their game in World cups or later stages of competitions as a good thing, I see it as a shame that he couldn't be arsed playing to his maximum every week.

Wait, what do you mean stepping up their game? You mean Zidane didn't go around dribbling everyone and putting fancy through balls against Recreativo Huelva? You mean he did just enough and they still won the league pretty comfortably?

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

You talking about Zidane? done fuck all? oh my god.

In a lot of league games yes. Obviously doing fuck all is hyperbole but he was very far from his best. You see someone like Zidane stepping up their game in World cups or later stages of competitions as a good thing, I see it as a shame that he couldn't be arsed playing to his maximum every week.

Which ones to be exact? But who ever plays their best in some league matches? you play your best in the most important games.

It's obvious you never seen Juve Zizou or there won't even be this argument. Only RM Zizou with stacked players.

BMxJoga wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:To be considered the best mere talent is not enough. Why should he be considered among the best if half the time he just strolled around doing absolutely fuck all.

Performances matter more than actual talent.

You talking about Zidane? done fuck all? oh my god.

In a lot of league games yes. Obviously doing fuck all is hyperbole but he was very far from his best. You see someone like Zidane stepping up their game in World cups or later stages of competitions as a good thing, I see it as a shame that he couldn't be arsed playing to his maximum every week.

Wait, what do you mean stepping up their game? You mean Zidane didn't go around dribbling everyone and putting fancy through balls against Recreativo Huelva? You mean he did just enough and they still won the league pretty comfortably?

Won the league once with Real Madrid, that was a failure considering the team they had and he contributed to that because he thought wrongly that he didn't have to put in great performances every week.

Zidane (even not performing in small games ) still one of Real Madrid's greatest ever, top assister in his final season, winner of 03 liga.

And yet is nowhere near Messi at club level.

I don't get how you would rate great performances? Besides I think I should also add that the league was much stronger when Zidane was with Madrid then it is now.

Fine Shagger wrote:And yet is nowhere near Messi at club level.

But still shits on Messi overall.

at thinking Zidane isn't one of the world's greatest. You'd be hard pressed to find a website with a top 10 players list that doesn't include Zidane. Widely regarded as one of the best.

Won a World Cup, got to another World Cup final in 2006 and won the Golden Ball for that World Cup too.

3 time Fifa world player of the year, matched only by Ronaldo.

Would Messi be winning as much if he wasn't at Barcelona? Doubt it. The fact he wins hardly anything with Argentina backs that up.

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:And yet is nowhere near Messi at club level.

But still shits on Messi overall.

Club >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> International

How. Many. Times. Do. I. Need. To. Say. This?

Maybe If I type it in bold it'll sink in:

2 top players X and Y will roughly play 50+ club games a season and say 7-10 internationals. X plays consistently much better, possibly the best season of any individual ever, during those 50+ games and underperforms in 7-10 internationals. Y plays below his best(still great, just not consistently) over the 50+ game period and unstoppable during the 7-10 games.

Who is better? X quite obviously.

Fine Shagger wrote:

chiboygeorge wrote:

Fine Shagger wrote:And yet is nowhere near Messi at club level.

But still shits on Messi overall.

Club >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> International

How. Many. Times. Do. I. Need. To. Say. This?

Maybe If I type it in bold it'll sink in:

2 top players X and Y will roughly play 50+ club games a season and say 7-10 internationals. X plays consistently much better, possibly the best season of any individual ever, during those 50+ games and underperforms in 7-10 internationals. Y plays below his best(still great, just not consistently) over the 50+ game period and unstoppable during the 7-10 games.

Who is better? X quite obviously.

I have to agree with Jamie on this one.