EU Referendum

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    How are you going to vote?

    [ 4 ]
    67% [67%] 
    [ 2 ]
    33% [33%] 
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    Total Votes: 6
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:34 am

    You keep missing the part where the British people were lied to.
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    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:44 am

    The Zlatan wrote:You keep missing the part where the British people were lied to.

    When?
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Sun Apr 24, 2016 8:05 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:You keep missing the part where the British people were lied to.

    When?

    In the early 1970s.
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    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Sun Apr 24, 2016 8:25 am

    Bs specific. What lie was told?
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Sun Apr 24, 2016 8:56 am

    That we were just joining a common market with some other 'perks'.
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    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:58 pm

    We were, stuff changed subsequently which our democratically elected representatives agreed to.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:26 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:We were, stuff changed subsequently which our democratically elected representatives agreed to.

    No, we were really joining a political union where sovereignty would be snatched from the hands of the British people.

    There are some in this country who fear that going into Europe we shall in some way sacrifice independence and sovereignty. These fears, I need hardly say, are completely unjustified.

    Ted Heath, 1973

    Are you now in favour of democracy?
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Tue May 10, 2016 3:11 am



    Is this the peak?
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    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Tue May 10, 2016 8:59 am

    Let's hope he is wrong. I wouldn't bet my life on it though.
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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Tue May 10, 2016 9:11 am

    13 former US Secretaries of State and Defence have written to The Times saying we should stay.
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    Glen Miller
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by Glen Miller on Tue May 10, 2016 9:24 am

    Roger Daltrey of The Who has said that we should leave.
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    Glen Miller
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by Glen Miller on Tue May 10, 2016 9:27 am

    Donald Trump as well.
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    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Tue May 10, 2016 10:03 am

    Five former secretaries general of NATO are on Team Bremain.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Wed May 11, 2016 1:35 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:Let's hope he is wrong.  I wouldn't bet my life on it though.

    What do you think is going to happen? Laughing
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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Wed May 11, 2016 2:17 am

    The Zlatan wrote:
    ResurrectionRooney wrote:Let's hope he is wrong.  I wouldn't bet my life on it though.

    What do you think is going to happen? Laughing

    Damage to the British economy, the pound to fall into the toilet, big reduction in our global influence. Medium to long term, possibly the break up of the European Union leading to more economic turmoil and nationalism within the EU. I don't think it would lead to a world war, but withdrawal from international organisations and reductions in interdependence create an increased possibility of conflict.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Wed May 11, 2016 10:36 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:

    What do you think is going to happen? Laughing

    Damage to the British economy, the pound to fall into the toilet, big reduction in our global influence.  Medium to long term, possibly the break up of the European Union leading to more economic turmoil and nationalism within the EU.  I don't think it would lead to a world war, but withdrawal from international organisations and reductions in interdependence create an increased possibility of conflict.

    The economy will be fine, the pound will fall regardless, you'll have to specify a bit more on global influence. The EU breaking up is a good thing.
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    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Wed May 11, 2016 7:20 pm

    The Zlatan wrote:
    ResurrectionRooney wrote:

    Damage to the British economy, the pound to fall into the toilet, big reduction in our global influence.  Medium to long term, possibly the break up of the European Union leading to more economic turmoil and nationalism within the EU.  I don't think it would lead to a world war, but withdrawal from international organisations and reductions in interdependence create an increased possibility of conflict.

    The economy will be fine, the pound will fall regardless, you'll have to specify a bit more on global influence. The EU breaking up is a good thing.

    Literally every authority worth listening to says that the economy won't be fine and we'll be worse off.

    Can you explain why you think the pound will fall? Everything I've read indicates it's almost certain to increase in value in the event of Bremain on account of the increased economic security.

    I get that you think the EU breaking up is a good thing, but as said it'll lead to more economic turmoil and nationalism among the member states. I see that as a negative.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Thu May 12, 2016 3:27 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:

    The economy will be fine, the pound will fall regardless, you'll have to specify a bit more on global influence. The EU breaking up is a good thing.

    Literally every authority worth listening to says that the economy won't be fine and we'll be worse off.

    Can you explain why you think the pound will fall?  Everything I've read indicates it's almost certain to increase in value in the event of Bremain on account of the increased economic security.

    I get that you think the EU breaking up is a good thing, but as said it'll lead to more economic turmoil and nationalism among the member states.  I see that as a negative.

    And each of those authorities said we'd be better off joining the Euro.

    The pound will continue to fall due to quantitative easing. Every developed economy on the planet is trying to lower the value of its currency right now.

    As compared to the economic disaster right now? Have you seen Greece and Spain etc? Nothing wrong with a bit of nationalism, I'm not sure why it's such a dirty word to you.
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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Fri May 13, 2016 4:28 am

    The Zlatan wrote:
    ResurrectionRooney wrote:

    Literally every authority worth listening to says that the economy won't be fine and we'll be worse off.

    Can you explain why you think the pound will fall?  Everything I've read indicates it's almost certain to increase in value in the event of Bremain on account of the increased economic security.

    I get that you think the EU breaking up is a good thing, but as said it'll lead to more economic turmoil and nationalism among the member states.  I see that as a negative.

    And each of those authorities said we'd be better off joining the Euro.

    The pound will continue to fall due to quantitative easing. Every developed economy on the planet is trying to lower the value of its currency right now.

    As compared to the economic disaster right now? Have you seen Greece and Spain etc? Nothing wrong with a bit of nationalism, I'm not sure why it's such a dirty word to you.

    My weatherman said it would rain a few weeks ago. It didn't. He's said that tomorrow there's going to be a big storm and it's going to absolutely piss it down. Should I bring an umbrella?

    It will fall faster and quantitative easing have less effect if there is less confidence in our currency.

    Yes, it will be much worse if we leave. I don't really give two shits about Greece, Spain etc. they're too small to matter. Same would apply if they were outside of the EU.

    I have a problem with nationalism because it's divisive, Europe is united by far more than it's separated by. We've seen the results of nationalism in Europe before.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Fri May 13, 2016 5:35 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:

    And each of those authorities said we'd be better off joining the Euro.

    The pound will continue to fall due to quantitative easing. Every developed economy on the planet is trying to lower the value of its currency right now.

    As compared to the economic disaster right now? Have you seen Greece and Spain etc? Nothing wrong with a bit of nationalism, I'm not sure why it's such a dirty word to you.

    My weatherman said it would rain a few weeks ago.  It didn't.  He's said that tomorrow there's going to be a big storm and it's going to absolutely piss it down.  Should I bring an umbrella?

    It will fall faster and quantitative easing have less effect if there is less confidence in our currency.

    Yes, it will be much worse if we leave.  I don't really give two shits about Greece, Spain etc. they're too small to matter.  Same would apply if they were outside of the EU.

    I have a problem with nationalism because it's divisive, Europe is united by far more than it's separated by.  We've seen the results of nationalism in Europe before.

    Did he? Is he paid by the umbrella shop to tell you it will rain all of the time? Does he know that his boss used to work for the umbrella shop too? Does he also know that some of his colleagues are shareholders in the umbrella shop?

    It's not necessarily a bad thing that the pound falls anyway, it will increase exports at a time when we have a huge trade deficit.

    If you don't give a shit why are you worried about the economic turmoil? It's funny that you support remaining because you think it will benefit the economy, and yet you're probably fully aware that the UK will have to provide massive chunks of money to every bailout that will be needed in the future when it all inevitably comes crashing down. Not to mention the addition of even more poor countries into the EU resulting in us paying even more into the system. It also leaves us exposed to even more migration that will further increase the economic costs on this country.

    Europe doesn't need a political union to be united. It's the lack of nationalism across Europe right  now that's leading to the surge in far right movements, had previous and current governments been responsible and not focused on some sort of idealistic, globalist utopia, parties like PEGIDA, NF, PVV and the likes wouldn't even be relevant right now. The policies of the EU will only lead to more nationalism in the future, do you really think the accession of countries like Turkey and Albania will reduce the levels of nationalism?
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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Fri May 13, 2016 7:12 am

    The Zlatan wrote:
    ResurrectionRooney wrote:

    My weatherman said it would rain a few weeks ago.  It didn't.  He's said that tomorrow there's going to be a big storm and it's going to absolutely piss it down.  Should I bring an umbrella?

    It will fall faster and quantitative easing have less effect if there is less confidence in our currency.

    Yes, it will be much worse if we leave.  I don't really give two shits about Greece, Spain etc. they're too small to matter.  Same would apply if they were outside of the EU.

    I have a problem with nationalism because it's divisive, Europe is united by far more than it's separated by.  We've seen the results of nationalism in Europe before.

    Did he? Is he paid by the umbrella shop to tell you it will rain all of the time? Does he know that his boss used to work for the umbrella shop too? Does he also know that some of his colleagues are shareholders in the umbrella shop?

    It's not necessarily a bad thing that the pound falls anyway, it will increase exports at a time when we have a huge trade deficit.

    If you don't give a shit why are you worried about the economic turmoil? It's funny that you support remaining because you think it will benefit the economy, and yet you're probably fully aware that the UK will have to provide massive chunks of money to every bailout that will be needed in the future when it all inevitably comes crashing down. Not to mention the addition of even more poor countries into the EU resulting in us paying even more into the system. It also leaves us exposed to even more migration that will further increase the economic costs on this country.

    Europe doesn't need a political union to be united. It's the lack of nationalism across Europe right  now that's leading to the surge in far right movements, had previous and current governments been responsible and not focused on some sort of idealistic, globalist utopia, parties like PEGIDA, NF, PVV and the likes wouldn't even be relevant right now. The policies of the EU will only lead to more nationalism in the future, do you really think the accession of countries like Turkey and Albania will reduce the levels of nationalism?

    Don't talk shit, Cameron, Osbourne, Obama, the many retired NATO Secretary Generals and the US Foreign, Defence and Finance secretaries are not being paid by the European Union, most of them have never been employed by it. Mark Carney certainly isn't.

    It is if you drive a car or your business relies on things getting delivered. It is if you like buying consumer electronics. I happen to fall into these categories.

    I'm worried about the economic turmoil that will his this country in the event of a leave vote because it effects my job and my families jobs.

    We don't have to pay money towards any bailouts.
    No country can enter the EU without us agreeing to it.
    Migration benefits the economy.

    As said, Turkey and Albania can't join without us and every other country in the union agreeing to it.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Fri May 13, 2016 8:48 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:

    Did he? Is he paid by the umbrella shop to tell you it will rain all of the time? Does he know that his boss used to work for the umbrella shop too? Does he also know that some of his colleagues are shareholders in the umbrella shop?

    It's not necessarily a bad thing that the pound falls anyway, it will increase exports at a time when we have a huge trade deficit.

    If you don't give a shit why are you worried about the economic turmoil? It's funny that you support remaining because you think it will benefit the economy, and yet you're probably fully aware that the UK will have to provide massive chunks of money to every bailout that will be needed in the future when it all inevitably comes crashing down. Not to mention the addition of even more poor countries into the EU resulting in us paying even more into the system. It also leaves us exposed to even more migration that will further increase the economic costs on this country.

    Europe doesn't need a political union to be united. It's the lack of nationalism across Europe right  now that's leading to the surge in far right movements, had previous and current governments been responsible and not focused on some sort of idealistic, globalist utopia, parties like PEGIDA, NF, PVV and the likes wouldn't even be relevant right now. The policies of the EU will only lead to more nationalism in the future, do you really think the accession of countries like Turkey and Albania will reduce the levels of nationalism?

    Don't talk shit, Cameron, Osbourne, Obama, the many retired NATO Secretary Generals and the US Foreign, Defence and Finance secretaries are not being paid by the European Union, most of them have never been employed by it.  Mark Carney certainly isn't.

    It is if you drive a car or your business relies on things getting delivered.  It is if you like buying consumer electronics.  I happen to fall into these categories.

    I'm worried about the economic turmoil that will his this country in the event of a leave vote because it effects my job and my families jobs.

    We don't have to pay money towards any bailouts.
    No country can enter the EU without us agreeing to it.
    Migration benefits the economy.

    As said, Turkey and Albania can't join without us and every other country in the union agreeing to it.

    Stop using shit analogies then.

    I suppose the Bank of England should stop printing money in that case. The biggest risk to the economy is deflation to all of the asset bubbles. Isn't it telling that when two members of the Financial Policy Committee appeared before the Treasury Select Committee for their re-appointment said that Brexit wasn't a major risk and brushed it off as nothing but a brief short term risk. They actually had to be pressed over it as they were asked what the two major risks were to the economy and neither of them mentioned it.

    There won't be any economic turmoil. We won't have to pay the membership fee any more, we can re-allocate the rebates which will be worth more because they don't have to go through a middle man. It's estimated the UK businesses pay £33 billion each year for EU regulations, that money will be saved. Food and other products will be cheaper because we'll be buying at world prices, not EU prices. Once plans are established post Brexit the economy will flourish. We're also tying ourselves to an economy that is rapidly slowing down with Antarctica being the only continent with worse growth, all while neglecting emerging markets around the world. You should check out the Five Presidents' report.

    Yup, just like we never had to pay for the Greek bailout.

    David "pave the road from Ankara to Brussels" Cameron agrees with you.

    Mass migration of unskilled workers doesn't.

    It's inevitably going to happen, along with Ukraine, Serbia, Macedonia and Montenegro. Then the expansion into North Africa but that's getting a bit conspiracyish and would be many years ahead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_for_the_Mediterranean
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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Fri May 13, 2016 7:47 pm

    The Zlatan wrote:
    ResurrectionRooney wrote:

    Don't talk shit, Cameron, Osbourne, Obama, the many retired NATO Secretary Generals and the US Foreign, Defence and Finance secretaries are not being paid by the European Union, most of them have never been employed by it.  Mark Carney certainly isn't.

    It is if you drive a car or your business relies on things getting delivered.  It is if you like buying consumer electronics.  I happen to fall into these categories.

    I'm worried about the economic turmoil that will his this country in the event of a leave vote because it effects my job and my families jobs.

    We don't have to pay money towards any bailouts.
    No country can enter the EU without us agreeing to it.
    Migration benefits the economy.

    As said, Turkey and Albania can't join without us and every other country in the union agreeing to it.

    Stop using shit analogies then.

    I suppose the Bank of England should stop printing money in that case. The biggest risk to the economy is deflation to all of the asset bubbles. Isn't it telling that when two members of the Financial Policy Committee appeared before the Treasury Select Committee for their re-appointment said that Brexit wasn't a major risk and brushed it off as nothing but a brief short term risk. They actually had to be pressed over it as they were asked what the two major risks were to the economy and neither of them mentioned it.

    There won't be any economic turmoil. We won't have to pay the membership fee any more, we can re-allocate the rebates which will be worth more because they don't have to go through a middle man. It's estimated the UK businesses pay £33 billion each year for EU regulations, that money will be saved. Food and other products will be cheaper because we'll be buying at world prices, not EU prices. Once plans are established post Brexit the economy will flourish. We're also tying ourselves to an economy that is rapidly slowing down with Antarctica being the only continent with worse growth, all while neglecting emerging markets around the world. You should check out the Five Presidents' report.

    Yup, just like we never had to pay for the Greek bailout.

    David "pave the road from Ankara to Brussels" Cameron agrees with you.

    Mass migration of unskilled workers doesn't.

    It's inevitably going to happen, along with Ukraine, Serbia, Macedonia and Montenegro. Then the expansion into North Africa but that's getting a bit conspiracyish and would be many years ahead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_for_the_Mediterranean

    Please don't insult my analogies, there are certain lines we shouldn't cross for the sake of decency. All my analogies are superb, if you don't understand them please just ask.

    If all the experts tell you something you should listen to it, that they've been wrong in the past doesn't mean they are wrong on this occasion or that people who are clueless about macroeconomics (vast majority of the population) know better.

    There's a balance one has to strike. The value of the pound being reduced naturally rather than artificially makes things much more difficult.

    Literally no economic study worth listening to agrees with your assertion that there won't be any economic turmoil. None of them. The Chancellor says you are wrong, the IMF and World Bank say you are wrong, the Bank of England say you are wrong, the Prime Minister says you are wrong. Even the main Brexit public figures don't say there won't be any economic turmoil, they just brush it off as "We don't know".

    If you're voting Brexit you have to be honest and accept that there will be an economic hit and you have to explain why the laws we'd pass ourselves instead of acquiescing to from the EU are important enough to sacrifice that.

    I may be wrong on this, but I don't think we ever paid for the Greek bailout. We've opted out from paying any bailouts to the Euro countries.

    They have to get every country in the EU to agree to let them in, it simply won't happen.

    Mass migration of unskilled workers creates more employment in this country, improves growth and improves contributions to the exchequer paying for public services. Immigrants are an exceptional boost to an economy because they are almost invariably of working age compared to natives who are often retired or retard meaning they can't work.

    Ukraine will not enter the EU until its issues with Russia are resolved, which is a very very long way down the line. Serbia, Macedonia and Montenegro I'm not too sure on but I'm confident that if they are allowed in it won't be too much of an issue. Allowing every single member to veto anyone joining puts a very firm brake on enlargement, it can't happen unless every state benefits from it.

    I don't think expansion into North Africa will ever happen. If we're looking beyond Europe I'd say places like Greenland or Canada are more likely, maybe even Australia or New Zealand. That would be many years down the line, however.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Sun May 15, 2016 7:25 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:

    Stop using shit analogies then.

    I suppose the Bank of England should stop printing money in that case. The biggest risk to the economy is deflation to all of the asset bubbles. Isn't it telling that when two members of the Financial Policy Committee appeared before the Treasury Select Committee for their re-appointment said that Brexit wasn't a major risk and brushed it off as nothing but a brief short term risk. They actually had to be pressed over it as they were asked what the two major risks were to the economy and neither of them mentioned it.

    There won't be any economic turmoil. We won't have to pay the membership fee any more, we can re-allocate the rebates which will be worth more because they don't have to go through a middle man. It's estimated the UK businesses pay £33 billion each year for EU regulations, that money will be saved. Food and other products will be cheaper because we'll be buying at world prices, not EU prices. Once plans are established post Brexit the economy will flourish. We're also tying ourselves to an economy that is rapidly slowing down with Antarctica being the only continent with worse growth, all while neglecting emerging markets around the world. You should check out the Five Presidents' report.

    Yup, just like we never had to pay for the Greek bailout.

    David "pave the road from Ankara to Brussels" Cameron agrees with you.

    Mass migration of unskilled workers doesn't.

    It's inevitably going to happen, along with Ukraine, Serbia, Macedonia and Montenegro. Then the expansion into North Africa but that's getting a bit conspiracyish and would be many years ahead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_for_the_Mediterranean

    Please don't insult my analogies, there are certain lines we shouldn't cross for the sake of decency.  All my analogies are superb, if you don't understand them please just ask.

    If all the experts tell you something you should listen to it, that they've been wrong in the past doesn't mean they are wrong on this occasion or that people who are clueless about macroeconomics (vast majority of the population) know better.

    There's a balance one has to strike.  The value of the pound being reduced naturally rather than artificially makes things much more difficult.

    Literally no economic study worth listening to agrees with your assertion that there won't be any economic turmoil.  None of them.  The Chancellor says you are wrong, the IMF and World Bank say you are wrong, the Bank of England say you are wrong, the Prime Minister says you are wrong.  Even the main Brexit public figures don't say there won't be any economic turmoil, they just brush it off as "We don't know".

    If you're voting Brexit you have to be honest and accept that there will be an economic hit and you have to explain why the laws we'd pass ourselves instead of acquiescing to from the EU are important enough to sacrifice that.

    I may be wrong on this, but I don't think we ever paid for the Greek bailout.  We've opted out from paying any bailouts to the Euro countries.

    They have to get every country in the EU to agree to let them in, it simply won't happen.

    Mass migration of unskilled workers creates more employment in this country, improves growth and improves contributions to the exchequer paying for public services.  Immigrants are an exceptional boost to an economy because they are almost invariably of working age compared to natives who are often retired or retard meaning they can't work.  

    Ukraine will not enter the EU until its issues with Russia are resolved, which is a very very long way down the line.  Serbia, Macedonia and Montenegro I'm not too sure on but I'm confident that if they are allowed in it won't be too much of an issue.  Allowing every single member to veto anyone joining puts a very firm brake on enlargement, it can't happen unless every state benefits from it.

    I don't think expansion into North Africa will ever happen.  If we're looking beyond Europe I'd say places like Greenland or Canada are more likely, maybe even Australia or New Zealand.  That would be many years down the line, however.

    All of the experts coming out telling us they know better, while at the same time having brown papers bags handed over to them, the very same experts who thought it was vital that we joined the Euro or face losing investment, the same experts that never saw the 2008 recession coming. The same experts who are doing what is right for themselves, because they have businesses to run and money to make. You'll have to forgive me if I seem a tad bit sceptical about all of this, after all, banks and governments would never lie, would they?

    It's the devaluation that the Bank of England wanted, just without having to print money and introduce 0% interest rates.

    All of this talk about economic turmoil, war, job losses and a host of other torrid situations and yet the Prime Minister thought it would be wise to let us vote on it, and half of his party are in support of it too. It's quite mad really, especially as he himself admitted to being open to leaving should he not get the deal he wanted, and he has also said that Britain could survive outside of the EU on a couple of occasions. There are plenty of perfectly respectable economists who think things will be fine, I'm more inclined to trust them over EU funded organizations all working towards the same goal. I think the honest choice in all of this is, leave now and face the minor risk of an economic downturn, or stay and have front row seats when the house of cards falls.

    Osborne did a U-turn. http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/07/17/osborne-forced-to-hand-over-850-million-to-greece-claims-victory-anyway/

    If Turkey are a candidate for accession it's always a possibility they will join, and that's not something I want to be a part of. Especially with all of the cosying up at the moment.

    It drives down wages and puts incredible pressure on public services. Not to mention the breakdown in societal relationships. You also have to look at where most of the migration is coming from, it's from poor countries where IQ levels are far lower than ours. This puts even more pressure on public services. Quick mention for the high crime rates they bring too. Oh, and all of that sweet, sweet cultural enrichment we've been exposed to lately.

    The rest is conjecture. On a side note though, it would be nice to know why you hate your country so much.
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    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Sun May 15, 2016 7:48 am

    It seems a bit implausible to me that they would all be lying in the same way. If they're wrong, if Britain were to leave the EU and do really well it would make them all look like fools.

    Right, but if the currency were devalued by some external means - ie. lack of confidence in the pound - in order to avoid the devaluation being excessive the BoE would have to raise interest rates. This would have a very negative impact on everyone with a mortgage.

    I agree, it was completely irresponsible for the Conservatives to offer a referendum. I voted against them for that reason. I don't think it's a commitment Cameron ever had any intention of delivering on considering that a majority was seen as highly unlikely and every other major party opposed the referendum.

    The idea he'd vote to leave was an obvious tactic for the renegotiation. I'm surprised you couldn't see that.

    I'm afraid I don't understand the terms of the Greek bailout, if we're definitely going to get our money back I don't see a problem though.

    Look at it this way. If we stay there's a possibility Turkey will get all of the benefits of membership if our government agrees to give them those benefits. If we leave the exact same applies. If they do join and we're not happy with it we can always leave in future.

    it's from poor countries where IQ levels are far lower than ours.

    Proof?

    I don't hate my country at all. I want what's best for it.
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    The Zlatan
     
     

    Posts : 10347

    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Mon May 16, 2016 12:42 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:It seems a bit implausible to me that they would all be lying in the same way.  If they're wrong, if Britain were to leave the EU and do really well it would make them all look like fools.

    Right, but if the currency were devalued by some external means - ie. lack of confidence in the pound - in order to avoid the devaluation being excessive the BoE would have to raise interest rates.  This would have a very negative impact on everyone with a mortgage.

    I agree, it was completely irresponsible for the Conservatives to offer a referendum.  I voted against them for that reason.  I don't think it's a commitment Cameron ever had any intention of delivering on considering that a majority was seen as highly unlikely and every other major party opposed the referendum.

    The idea he'd vote to leave was an obvious tactic for the renegotiation.  I'm surprised you couldn't see that.

    I'm afraid I don't understand the terms of the Greek bailout, if we're definitely going to get our money back I don't see a problem though.

    Look at it this way.  If we stay there's a possibility Turkey will get all of the benefits of membership if our government agrees to give them those benefits.  If we leave the exact same applies.  If they do join and we're not happy with it we can always leave in future.

    it's from poor countries where IQ levels are far lower than ours.

    Proof?

    I don't hate my country at all.  I want what's best for it.

    I don't think it's implausible, they have money to make. Britain remaining in the EU is in their best interests. Yeah, it might for a brief moment, but no one will really care or remember until they start meddling again.

    That can be offset by the reduction in costs of food and items and by the increase in wages.

    I think he's done a great thing, he's given us the opportunity to be an independent country again, free to make decisions in its best interests.

    Hey, I'm just going to take his word for it. He's the Prime Minister after all.

    We'll just have to wait and see.

    I'd rather not even risk entering a political union with an Islamic country.

    Using the amount of National Insurance Numbers registered, the five main EU countries which people are emigrating from are:-

    1. Romania - 170,000
    2. Poland - 111,000
    3. Italy - 59,000
    4. Spain - 50,000
    5 - Bulgaria - 39,000

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/bulletins/migrationstatisticsquarterlyreport/february2016

    These are the average IQ levels for those countries:-

    Romania - 94
    Poland - 99
    Italy - 102
    Spain - 98
    Bulgaria - 93

    UK - 100

    https://iq-research.info/en/page/average-iq-by-country

    Could have fooled me.
    avatar
    The Zlatan
     
     

    Posts : 10347

    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Mon May 16, 2016 12:44 am

    Everyone should watch this too.
    avatar
    ResurrectionRooney
     
     

    Posts : 17673
    Supports : United

    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by ResurrectionRooney on Mon May 16, 2016 9:48 am

    The Zlatan wrote:
    ResurrectionRooney wrote:It seems a bit implausible to me that they would all be lying in the same way.  If they're wrong, if Britain were to leave the EU and do really well it would make them all look like fools.

    Right, but if the currency were devalued by some external means - ie. lack of confidence in the pound - in order to avoid the devaluation being excessive the BoE would have to raise interest rates.  This would have a very negative impact on everyone with a mortgage.

    I agree, it was completely irresponsible for the Conservatives to offer a referendum.  I voted against them for that reason.  I don't think it's a commitment Cameron ever had any intention of delivering on considering that a majority was seen as highly unlikely and every other major party opposed the referendum.

    The idea he'd vote to leave was an obvious tactic for the renegotiation.  I'm surprised you couldn't see that.

    I'm afraid I don't understand the terms of the Greek bailout, if we're definitely going to get our money back I don't see a problem though.

    Look at it this way.  If we stay there's a possibility Turkey will get all of the benefits of membership if our government agrees to give them those benefits.  If we leave the exact same applies.  If they do join and we're not happy with it we can always leave in future.



    Proof?

    I don't hate my country at all.  I want what's best for it.

    I don't think it's implausible, they have money to make. Britain remaining in the EU is in their best interests. Yeah, it might for a brief moment, but no one will really care or remember until they start meddling again.

    That can be offset by the reduction in costs of food and items and by the increase in wages.

    I think he's done a great thing, he's given us the opportunity to be an independent country again, free to make decisions in its best interests.

    Hey, I'm just going to take his word for it. He's the Prime Minister after all.

    We'll just have to wait and see.

    I'd rather not even risk entering a political union with an Islamic country.

    Using the amount of National Insurance Numbers registered, the five main EU countries which people are emigrating from are:-

    1. Romania - 170,000
    2. Poland - 111,000
    3. Italy - 59,000
    4. Spain - 50,000
    5 - Bulgaria - 39,000

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/bulletins/migrationstatisticsquarterlyreport/february2016

    These are the average IQ levels for those countries:-

    Romania - 94
    Poland - 99
    Italy - 102
    Spain - 98
    Bulgaria - 93

    UK - 100

    https://iq-research.info/en/page/average-iq-by-country

    Could have fooled me.

    They make their careers on being better than average about financial matters, they're not going to go very public with predictions they think are incorrect, it's ridiculous. Some of them don't even have careers any more, they're retired.

    Food and "items" will increase in price because our currency will be worth less.

    We're already an independent country and already make free decisions, in 1973 we decided to join the EEC and we've decided to apply their laws because our elected governments feel it's in our best interests to do so. You're trying to force the government to do something it thinks go against our best interests.

    Do you have any idea how negotiations work?

    So would I, but we have a fucking veto.

    These results are controversial and have caused much debate, they must be interpreted with extreme caution.

    I'm starting to think that wouldn't be very difficult.
    avatar
    The Zlatan
     
     

    Posts : 10347

    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by The Zlatan on Wed May 18, 2016 2:28 am

    ResurrectionRooney wrote:
    The Zlatan wrote:

    I don't think it's implausible, they have money to make. Britain remaining in the EU is in their best interests. Yeah, it might for a brief moment, but no one will really care or remember until they start meddling again.

    That can be offset by the reduction in costs of food and items and by the increase in wages.

    I think he's done a great thing, he's given us the opportunity to be an independent country again, free to make decisions in its best interests.

    Hey, I'm just going to take his word for it. He's the Prime Minister after all.

    We'll just have to wait and see.

    I'd rather not even risk entering a political union with an Islamic country.

    Using the amount of National Insurance Numbers registered, the five main EU countries which people are emigrating from are:-

    1. Romania - 170,000
    2. Poland - 111,000
    3. Italy - 59,000
    4. Spain - 50,000
    5 - Bulgaria - 39,000

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/bulletins/migrationstatisticsquarterlyreport/february2016

    These are the average IQ levels for those countries:-

    Romania - 94
    Poland - 99
    Italy - 102
    Spain - 98
    Bulgaria - 93

    UK - 100

    https://iq-research.info/en/page/average-iq-by-country

    Could have fooled me.

    They make their careers on being better than average about financial matters, they're not going to go very public with predictions they think are incorrect, it's ridiculous.  Some of them don't even have careers any more, they're retired.

    Food and "items" will increase in price because our currency will be worth less.

    We're already an independent country and already make free decisions, in 1973 we decided to join the EEC and we've decided to apply their laws because our elected governments feel it's in our best interests to do so.  You're trying to force the government to do something it thinks go against our best interests.

    Do you have any idea how negotiations work?

    So would I, but we have a fucking veto.

    These results are controversial and have caused much debate, they must be interpreted with extreme caution.

    I'm starting to think that wouldn't be very difficult.

    Just because they don't believe they're incorrect doesn't make them right. They've been wrong in the past, they'll be wrong again in the future.



    Costs will go down because we won't have to pay EU prices as we'd be out of the single market, we can then trade at world prices, this would lower the cost of living by 8%, and that's before any free trade agreements are made. A price increase on imports would work out well for domestic businesses and create jobs.

    Well we've already had this conversation and it ended up with you never responding.

    Judging by the leak that came out today, I'm not sure if David Cameron does.

    Our veto won't be much use if no one is going to use it.

    I can accept that, but is it really out of the realms of possibility that countries like Romania and Bulgaria with a HDI rating of 0.793 and 0.782 compared to the UK's 0.907, with murder rates per 100,000 people both being 1.5 compared to the UK's 1.0, with alcohol death rate per 100,000 people at 3.08 and 3.91, compared to the UK's 1.70, with HIV/AIDS deaths per 100,000 people being 1.18 and 3.63 compared to the UK's 0.42, countries with higher suicide rates, countries over 20 places behind us in the school rankings for maths and science, would have a lower IQ?

    Top banter.

    Re: EU Referendum

    Post by Keyser Söze on Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:52 am

    Seems to me that the overwhelming biggest thing people want to vote leave for is immigration. Obviously that isn't the case for everyone voting leave, Zlatan is testament to that. But whenever you seem to get the opinion of an average Joe wanting to leave their reasons always seem to be that immigrants are a burden on this country and that they are "changing" it.

    That changing it part is key because to me it sounds very much like they alluding to "Muslims" or to be more ethnically exact Arabs/Kurds/Asians/Africans etc... Because let be honest, if the UK kicked all the immigrants outs but kept just the ones of European descent (whether that be Polish, Slovakian or whatever) then I don't think immigration would be as big an issue.

    And with that being the case how would voting OUT stop people coming in from Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan....? That's a genuine question I have.

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    Re: EU Referendum

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